Welcome to liveblogging day 111 Zimmerman trial (morning session)

Tuesday, July 9, 2013

Good morning:

Let us begin this day with the sincere hope that the prosecution and Judge Nelson woke up this morning refreshed and focused on repairing the damage caused yesterday by the unexpected defense motion and related discovery violations that sidetracked the trial yesterday.

I believe court is going to resume at 8:30 am EDT.

Here’s the link to the livestream coverage.


See you in court.


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1,634 Responses to Welcome to liveblogging day 111 Zimmerman trial (morning session)

  1. nocamo33 says:

    “All warfare is based on deception. Hence, when able to attack, we must seem unable; when using our forces, we must seem inactive; when we are near, we must make the enemy believe we are far away; when far away, we must make him believe we are near.”

    Sun Tzu, Art of Prosecution in the State of Florida…errr, I mean War!

    My response to watching the days proceedings. Great job BDLR/PROS. Great freaking job!!

  2. Valerie says:

    Violations of sequestration !!! Go Mantei…

  3. MrSykes says:


  4. Cynthia, TX says:

    If the blood on GZ didn’t wash away that night then why did the blood wash away on TM? what’s so special about his blood not getting washed away but the victims blood did? just food for thought

    • Lonnie Starr says:

      All Omar is doing is driving the jurors crazy. That Root guy was a terrible disaster, both for himself, his company and for the defense.

      Angela Corey was sort of shaking her head in disbelief, and you can bet she’s tried cases and heard many police officers “testilying” so Root had to go some to get that response from her. Worse yet, even the people in the audience were astonished. you can bet the jurors felt insulted by this complete waste of their time.

      He starts out sounding sweetly reasonable and knowledgeable, then B-A-N-G!!! He’s revealed as a “witness for hire”, but that’s not so bad if he can keep the knowledgeable thing going, but sadly no!

      He starts off by equivocating badly, then he starts resorting to complex/evasive stock answers. The “smack in the head” comes when he’s asked questions that he obviously can’t possibly know the answers to, because of the answer he gave to a previous question. {{{{{000== WHAT??!!??!!?? ==000}}}}} BLITHERING IDIOT!!! Does he think that the jurors have no memory at all? Or is he one of those “experts”, the talking heads who come on during the breaks, and patiently explain to us that ice is cold, but not if it’s been heated up!!! If you know the subject, it takes about ten seconds to figure out that they have no clue what they’re talking about, or worse, and agenda.

      Now Omar is facing severe sanctions and possibly a contempt citation. Did you hear his voice weaken as he tried to obfuscate? Judge Nelson is conflicted about it, she feels very sorry for Omar, knowing how very much he’d like to play with the “big boys”, but he’s way too ill equipped.

      But, by now the jurors know that it’s Omar causing the delays and the problems as he struggles to put on a case using obvious falsehoods he keeps repeating over and over, even after they’ve been disproved. Just wait until the jurors hear that the small flashlight is evidence of nothing at all, because gz went to that area after he fired the gunshot, then claimed that everything happened right there. With the rest of the evidence, that more reasonably had to stay with these two, is strewn near the body.

      I think at one point he told Jon that his gun was on the ground. My guess is he thought of planting it there at the T as well, but thought better of it.

  5. KateW says:

    Grrrr Mantei on the attack! Roh rohhhhh

  6. KateW says:

    If he cannot say it is accurate then it should not be allowed. It is a speculation of the evidence and could be created to sway the jury visually as to what they claim factually happened. There are also several different versions of the story so which version are they going to depict? Will they depict which version? This just doesn’t fly. I think it should not be allowed.

  7. KateW says:

    He cannot depict visually for Ms Liar, I mean Lauer, then it’s like visual speculation isnt it?

  8. Wendie Dox says:

    i almost feel sorry for this guy… ALMOST.

  9. KateW says:

    The height and weight are not necessary?? Really? So they can make Trayvon appear shorter or make this guy appear smaller so that it looks as if Trayvon was looming over him.

    I don’t think this should be allowed.

  10. Nellie Nell says:

    Dayum, Mantei is cutting this dude no slack. I almost feel sorry for him. LOL “I didn’t measure their arms”.

  11. MrSykes says:

    Get ’em Mantei! Get ’em!!!

  12. KateW says:

    What is with all the eye twitching.

  13. MrSykes says:

    Donnelly hearing!!!!

  14. Tzar says:

    “a sick woman in her bed, your honor, I think she can go”

    wow O’Mara is so caring

  15. Nellie Nell says:

    Who is this chic and why is she laying in bed lying for the killer?

  16. KateW says:

    Another person saying it was this guy screaming, perhaps the prosecution should have brought in all of Martin’s family, friends, neighbors, etc to say it was him screaming for help.

    • MrSykes says:

      Actually less is more. The State is wise not to bring in too many people to “vouch” for the voice. The introduction of so many random people who are so “certain” that the voice was Fogen’s just makes the defense look very desperate and actually works against their credibility.

        • racerrodig says:

          Looks like I missed a good time. Listen….I have an uncle that’s not doing anything….what say I have him get in contact with The Moron Man and he can say it was Fogen screaming as well.

          I’d bet he’s more convincing that Jorge has was…….I was on the computer……what a tool !!

      • KateW says:

        I was being sarcastic 🙂

      • KateW says:

        Being that everyone and their momma is saying that is the defendant screaming for help, I was being sarcastic about the prosecution doing the same. Perhaps OMara can get someone in China to say it was the defendant screaming. *scoff*

    • Nellie Nell says:

      The efforts to prove that the person screaming for dear life and ends up dead is way too much. It makes the defense pretty damn desperate that they have to get so many people to say this while these people have never heard Trayvon nor do they listen to the “Get Off” and nevermind that the screams end with the shot being fired. These clowns are just making themselves look really bad. I hope the jury has had enough of their freaking lies by now.

  17. KateW says:

    The point of this witness….see I know Black people or I have Black friends too.

  18. Dee says:

    They will always find another black that will come against another black. But they will stand together no matter what.

  19. Dee says:

    Notice how much bad luck MOM has been having? God is punishing him because of who he is defending, a child killer no better then all the rest.

  20. Dee says:

    MOM need to get him some better teeth then those that he has. Because he looks like a horse when he laughs.

  21. bellesouth says:

    Does this guy have a tell?

  22. Nellie Nell says:

    Did BDLR just look at his watch?

  23. Dee says:

    Didn’t he said he was not an expert in all of these other fields. So why is he answering them without state objecting?

  24. KateW says:

    LOL Di Maeo said if he had such a horrific injury he should have gone straight to the emergency room. Given his GCS it was obvious his injuries were not significant enough for him to want a trip to the ER. In fact, they were so insignificant he went to a clinic the next day for a return to work pass. Why? Cuz Jethro felt juuuust fine.

  25. KateW says:

    I’d punk him in the nose too if he wouldnt get off of me or let go of me. Remember Rachel said Martin kept saying Get off, get off. So naturally, if a stranger, someone you didn’t know was grabbing you then yes you would deck them. My momma said the same thing. She said had the guy been following her she would have hit him too because she would not have known who he was, and then to grab someone is even more violation of personal space. So Martin was justified in his punch if the stranger would not let go of him. I told my mom you beat em with your purse but then most likely this punk would pull out his gun and put a hole in you.

    • KateW says:


    • nocamo33 says:

      Trayvon was justified. He did what any reasonable person in his situation would do. Zimmerman did the opposite of what a reasonable person would/should do. Supremacists don’t like that a black kid would have the right to fight back. I learned from this trial that “supremacists” don’t necessarily have buzz cuts, swastika’s tattood to their chest and criminal records. Many of them have keyboards, youtube and huffpo accounts and work as blue/white collared folk and serve as news anchors and reporters.

  26. Sleuth says:

    Did he just say witnesses are wrong ALL the time?

  27. Sleuth says:

    So the duh-fense failed to tell the good doc their client was left handed.

  28. Fred O'Cliff says:

    Does it always take hours for comments to make it through moderation here? If so, I would just like to say that it is extremely off-putting.

  29. KateW says:

    Bernie is so kind. Keeps asking the guy if he needs water. What a gracious host lol

  30. Tee says:

    Bernie you better work!

  31. GrannyStandingforTruth says:

    I hope Bernie keeps him on the witness stand and grills him until he admits the truth because Di Maio is a paid liar and it was obvious when defense was questioning him.

    • KateW says:

      Well he has a vested interest because he is being paid. I wouldnt call him a liar but he has to give testimony more in the defense favor because he is being paid. But that is why he is being evasive with some of the questions or a little shaky with his answer. He doesnt want to give credit to the prosecution. Looking up and to the right is one of his tells.

      • KateW says:

        Looking up to the left was also a tell of the defense witness yesterday, real mousy lady with long straight hair. She would also look up to the right. She was horrible witness for them, but the defense wanted to call everyone and their mother about that being this dude screaming. *scoff*

      • MedicineBear says:

        Another tell — when he ducks low flying invisible geese. Twitch, twitch, tic, DUCK!

  32. Leslie says:

    fogen’s breathing hard again! lmao…must be thinking about not getting his cheetos..

  33. MedicineBear says:

    Blood going toward back if laying on back! ZING!

  34. Sleuth says:

    Does anyone recognize the guy who is seated on the first row of gallery, behind the duh-fense?

    He’s wearing what looks like a pale lavender, long sleeve shirt, w/ a tie.

  35. KateW says:

    Bernie “What would you expect to be on my hands if I covered a bloody nose?” FINALLY!!!

  36. MedicineBear says:

    Blood on hand! BAM!

  37. KateW says:

    Yes!!!! YEs finally there was no blood on the hands. Bernie using the photo as an example was GREAT!!!!

  38. KateW says:

    YES!! Rolling around in the dirt can cause those injuries!

  39. Sleuth says:

    Like how BDLR got the word “scratches” in there about the boos-boos on the head.

  40. GrannyStandingforTruth says:

    Why don’t they have two people demonstrate the positions in court for people to see it?

  41. Sleuth says:

    Anybody recognize who the guy is, seated on the first row of gallery, duh-fense side?

    He’s wearing, looks like a pale lavender long sleeve shirt w/tie.

  42. KateW says:

    The eye twitching lol

  43. MedicineBear says:

    Tree branches! BOOM!

  44. Leslie says:

    Trayvon pulling away!!Tear him a new ass Bernie!

  45. MedicineBear says:


  46. bettykath says:

    bingo!!! the shirt would have to be moved and if it were, when the shirt goes back in position the holes won’t line up!!! he just became the prosecution’s best witness

    • KateW says:

      Well he is being paid by the defense so he has a vested interest in the defense claims or swaying his testimony for them. 400/hr is a lot of money for this guy to debunk the defense.

      • Lonnie Starr says:

        He’s probably not going to get paid. He was seeking the publicity to kick off his new “witness for hire” company, so he probably deferred payment until later, because he was eager to take the stand in front of millions of people worldwide.

        The prosecution had him held over for recall, so his fees would continue to run, that sent Omar into a fit. First he wanted to talk to the Judge about it, to see if he could get him released, but the Judge refused to talk about it. As Root was leaving Omar asked him to wait a minute, but Root realized what a disaster this was and that he probably wouldn’t get paid, but he’d also have to look for a new line of work, hahahaha, so he brushed off Omar and raced from the court, never to be seen again -hopefully! Oh wait, he could single handedly put gz behind bars, so let’s hope Bernie calls him back again, after all, it’s on Omar’s dime! Hahaha!

  47. GrannyStandingforTruth says:

    That is one lying SOB, that flashlight could be a weapon, so could keys. You can see it in his eyes and expression on his face that he is lying.

  48. Nef05 says:

    GO BERNIE!!!!

    Not a big deal of hardsmack with hard flashlight, but hit someone with a fist, as the reach for a gun, and “Oh my…. It’s SUPERTHUG SLIMM MAJIC DYNAMITE WITH XRAY VISION AND EIGHT ARMS”.

    It’s time for my pain meds, he has my bumhole hurting!!!

  49. MedicineBear says:

    Creepy. This witness looks like a Bond villain. I expect to see him stroking a large iguana perched in his lap.

  50. colin black says:

    400 bucks an hour.

  51. KateW says:

    GOOD DAY ALL! What’d I miss?! Just coming in. Looks like Bernie is questioning Di Maeo.

    Did he ask him yet why the kid would have no blood on his hands and sleeves? Blood splatter?

  52. Leslie says:

    Gettem Bernie!!!

  53. Sabrina B. says:

    What are the odds of a head injury with no marks. What are the odds of a paramedic inadvertently pushing a nose back in? What are the odds that a person sitting on top of him can see his gun which is behind him? What are the odds that those marks could possibly lead to death? Either the defendant should be much worse for the wear of he should be permanently stationed in a Vegas casino, don’t you think?

  54. KateW says:

    GOOD DAY ALL! What’d I miss?!

  55. chi1224 says:

    I find DiMaeo creepy. Just my opinion.

  56. disappointed says:

    Keep pointing out what a liar Fogen is and always will be.

  57. fauxmccoy says:

    someone’s getting rattled 😀

  58. chi1224 says:


  59. Mojo says:

    Rip him a new on Bernie!

  60. Elizabeth says:

    OMG @ the video’s above. The recoil theory is totally possible,even standing up. I never quite went for it before.

  61. Trial-is-underwaybaby says:

    GET EM…..!!!

  62. chi1224 says:

    Di Maeo twitching

  63. disappointed says:

    Respectfully the other person is not among the living. EXACTLY.

  64. Trial-is-underwaybaby says:

    a butt butt butt….

  65. KittySP says:

    Afternoon, I, like many here today, stopped listening this a.m. during dauber hearing and only reading along…unless I’m misinterpreting what I’ve read so far…this witness hasn’t said anything of value so has to hurt the states case, nor beneficial to defense, other than what is the obvious, that he was paid to say this or that. Don’t know what the paid to have him testify…but as the say goes…”You get what you paid for!”

    Praying the state is on their ‘A-game’…and ready to bring us in the final stretch.

  66. fauxmccoy says:

    oh, this is classic bernie — get him, bernie, get him!!

  67. gwynne says:

    Good Bernie, slow him down. When witness appears nervous, he seems to speed up.

  68. chi1224 says:

    Go Bernie, smack this hired gun down!

  69. disappointed says:

    At least 5 different statements! Love it!

  70. Two sides to a story says:

    Bernardo on fire!

  71. Leslie says:

    hmmmm, look how unbelievably short his answers are now…pos

  72. disappointed says:

    Okay this is good. Has no clue who started what, or if there was even a punch thrown.

  73. Sabrina B. says:

    Play the odds Bernie. What are the odds of this happening? what are the odds of that happening?

  74. disappointed says:

    I have to leave soon. I am going to need a couple good smack downs before I go!

  75. Sophia33 says:

    Go get him prosecution!

  76. Trial-is-underwaybaby says:

    HERE we go… come on Bernie, Trayvon is counting on YOU to BRING IT!

  77. Deborah Moore says:

    Warning on the seemingly nonsequiter here,
    But, I want to send this song out to Sabrina Fulton.
    I can’t imagine any woman going through what she has and still is going through. Her faith is strong.
    It’s gospel and it’s the Hot!

  78. KA says:

    I posted a link on another thread, but a savvy Prosecutor from AZ used this Dr. opinion against the defense and won her case when it looked like the chips were down.

    She studied his books for weeks beforehand and caught him in a section he was not prepared to talk about..dominant hand and stabbing wounds which proved the defendant guilty, all while being called by the defense.

    It was a “Perry Mason” moment I can only hope BLDR is up for.

    This is someone to nail and neuter in front of the jury. No more nice.

  79. willisnewton says:

    Hey leslie, can you comment on what you observed in the courtroom? Have you done this elsewhere already? I’ve wanted to know where GZ is LOOKING when we see him cast his eyes right or left, etc. Did he ever turn around?

  80. DruDo says:

    Bernie should have been following with us…then there would be a critical mass occurrence for fogen for sure. We wouldn’t let that scumbag defense get away with anything!

    • whonoze says:

      And if sports fans were coaches, their teams would never lose a game… Like most things, I’d guess being a trial attorney is harder than it looks. Not that Bernie’s doing a great job. But it’s certainly hubris for folks who know nothing about the rules of law and court procedures to imagine we would be awesomely better.

      • KittySP says:

        In other words…we each should stay in our own lanes😀

      • ada4750 says:

        When O’Mara and West don’t like an answer from any witness they will ask and ask the same questions with slight different way until they got an answer they like better. We see very rarely BDLR doing this.

        Also, he missed a thousand questions to Serino and Singleton. He would not have got firm answers from them but he would have put some materials in jury’s mind.

      • DruDo says:

        Wow. I wasn’t being arrogant, whonoze, nor do I pretend to be a lawyer. Obviously, my comment was intended to be a joke. But, this case has been intelligently dissected repeatedly and thoroughly here and I don’t doubt we could give Bernie a little nudge now and then. I wouldn’t be at all surprised if there weren’t a few legal pros and LE people on here, so I expect some may be more knowledgeable than you think.

        • cielo62 says:

          DruDo~ Take heart. I didn’t take your comment as a criticism either. But we DO have a few very negative personalities on here, and their complaints have been getting OLD and COLD. I think Bernie would agree, you are NEVER to “good” to know it all or see it all. Could be Pirhana Mom’s keen eye was the one that outed Donnelly!


          • DruDo says:

            Thanks, cielo. I don’t think any of us want there to be any missteps in this. There should be justice for Trayvon and I think we would all like to see that happen.

  81. My Forehead Tho says:

    Though I believe this gun has more recoil than the gun Fogen used, imagine her holding the gun with one. Now imagine her laying down and holding the gun with one hand.

  82. pork que says:

    Will the State ask Di Maio (the animal killer) if the small cuts on the back of the child-Killer’s head could have been days old and from his weekly MMA training?

  83. Malamiyya says:

    So, it’s put up or shut up time for Bernie. If he’s all rep that he can’t live up, if he is incompetent, or if he’s only putting on a halfhearted case, that is going to be revealed. If he has prosecutorial mojo and has done his homework, that will be revealed, too. Today.

  84. I as very unhappy with Dr. Di Maio right now and I believe there are any number of trauma surgeons who would disagree with his opinions.

    Now you have an excellent example of the reason for having a rebuttal case.

    Court will resume at 1:30 pm EDT.

    • Eric says:

      Professor, what will BDLR ask in a rebuttal that he hasn’t asked on cross?

    • GrannyStandingforTruth says:

      I’m not a trauma surgeon and I disagree with his opinions. He is full of it. I wish the prosecutors would have borrowed one of our top surgeons at Stanford Medical Center in Palo Alto. We have some of the best doctors there.

    • chi1224 says:

      He lied for Spector too and that didn’t work.

    • Beverly says:

      And WestCo/Ommm wasted 1/2 a morning, or more, with that jerk movie maker. How can they use a constructed re-enactment with the real person is sitting right there? I do not get it; I know he does not have to testify. But, should he be allowed a mouth-piece puppet?

    • newmediacounsel says:

      Can the expert witness be challenged as far as tendency to argue in favor of improbable and , in some case, impossible outcomes in cases?

      I know other experts can be put on, but I think there must be some way to address his credibility, or lack thereof?

  85. J4TMinATL says:

    I agree. I believe she said as few as 3?

    Dr. Valerie Rao testified to GZ’s injuries as insignificant and minor. Most important, she said his injuries were NOT consistent with head slamming multiple times. She stated his injuries were not life threatening.

    Dr. Valerie Rao has a questionable controversial past. I don’t think it matters.

    “If you look at the injuries, they’re so minor that, to me the word “slam” implies great force. And this, the resultant injuries are not great force, so if somebody’s head was repeatedly slammed against concrete with great force, I would expect lacerations. I would expect a lot of injury that would bleed profusely, that would necessitate suturing, and so I don’t see that in this picture.”

    • amsterdam1234 says:

      There are 5 mothers on the jury. They’ve seen bumps, bruises and cuts. GZ’s booboo’s were the hug and a cookie kind.

      Interesting enough I saw a tweet about the jury’s reaction, when GZ’s bloody photos were shown. The only juror who showed some kind of reaction, was the arm wrestle guy.
      I don’t think women are as sqeamish about blood as men are.

    • Yorazigo says:

      And most likely bleeding in the brain (inter or intra cranial?)

      • J4TMinATL says:

        I think the jurors will find Dr. Valerie Rao’s testimony accurate. I can look all day at GZ’s insignificant injuries but I cannot continue to look at Trayvon’s body and his wounds.

        Those women had to view exhibit photos of Trayvon’s nude body murdered by a single gunshot to his chest. Jurors won’t forget what they saw up on the screen just like I will never forget seeing his body laying face down in the grass and the picture of Trayvon turned on his back in the attempt to save his life.

  86. pork que says:

    I notice West did not ask Di Maio why the blood streaming from the back of the Killer’s head was streaming toward his ears (showing the Killer was leaning forward NOT on his back)

    • Malamiyya says:

      It’s a simple test question, isn’t it? Will Bernie ask it?

    • Dee says:

      No one has ever asked this yet, and anybody can see this. Why no one has asked is beyond me. I noticed that as soon as I had seen the pictures because gravity doesn’t lie.

  87. Yorazigo says:

    This defense is soooo phoney. Remember how they complained about the exorbitant cost of deposing pros voice expert – was it Owen?

  88. degraveegmailcom says:

    I keep thinking that when F. got up of the victim he walked towards the T and paced around with his hand to his head and scratched himself with his keys which he then wiped and chucked.

    • anita says:

      ~degrave I always tho’t he cut his own head with the keys, also. Somebody on here says “no way, NO dna or traces of blood on keys.” Selma testified he made 2 trips to the T, so he for sure threw the keys & flashlite down then.

    • willisnewton says:

      No tests were performed on many of the items he may have self-inflicted injuries with, so that’s going to be difficult to prove in THIS trial. Perhaps a civil suit can go into that aspect of what may or may not have happened. I’ve wondered myself if the keys were used and thrown, but you know, there was only ONE key on that ring with a small flashlight and we don’t even know if it was GZ’s key or the key to Shellie’s honda.

  89. Stormwatch says:

    Zimmerman was using his stronger left arm to pull the kids shirt down and the weaker right hand to grip the gun and shoot. That’s why the holes don’t align and that why there’s none of the defendants blood on TM except that tiny spec on the shirt. The defendant did not start bleeding from the face until his gun kicked back and him him in the nose and upper lip. That’s why he didn’t want to go to the hospital. He knew that the folks in the ER would possibly recognize gun recoil.

    • PiranhaMom says:

      Every word true, Stormwatch!

    • gwynne says:

      i also think he didn’t want to be checked for drugs and alcohol.

    • chi1224 says:

      And I will bet money fogen was holding on to Trayvon’s RIGHT side. Trayvon’s only defense wound is on his left hand. Why? Because he did not have control of his right side because that’s where Zimmerman was restraining him. That’s how I see it.

    • He didn’t go to the hospital because he didn’t want a toxicology test.

    • MDH says:

      If GZ was pulling with his left hand, then his shoulder would rotate to face T and the right forearm with the gun would be over the top of the left. Gunshots can cause blowback of blood. Note that some T DNA was found on GZ’s left shoulder and right sleeve { I think? }. It would fit the geometry of GZ shooting T from a standing position while pulling the hoodie with his left hand.

    • PiranhaMom says:

      Yes, Stormwatch, the medics would recognize recoil. THANKS!

  90. pork que says:

    I notice Di Maio did not mention the IMPOSSIBILITY to speak after the lung has two bullet holes in it — Di Maio only mentioned the heart having two holes.

    It is physically impossible for any human to speak when their LUNG has two holes in it.

  91. pork que says:

    How many animals did Di Maio kill in order to determine that a human can still talk after having their “heart pulled out” of their chest.

    • anita says:

      ~pork When I heard that it made me sick & so sad. He shot them, what a horrible person.

    • Jasmine says:

      And I had no idea that animals could talk…go figure.

      • pork que says:

        Exactly … yet the Killer’s paid witness stated that as if he had scientific proof that a human would still be chatting up a storm after having their “heart pulled out” of their chest.

      • Malisha says:

        You know, those animals that call you “homie” and all like that.

    • DruDo says:

      I’m glad I’m not watching this and am just following along with all the comments here. My blood pressure skyrockets with anything and anyone associated with this scummy defense and that ain’t good. If I recall correctly, there are two jurors who are/were animal rescuers. That horrible stuff sure won’t go over with them, especially. It shouldn’t go over with anyone, but that’s sure to leave a very negative impression with the two rescuers. That alone would make me want to get up and spit in his face.

  92. HeresLookingatYOU says:

    someone sorry

  93. HeresLookingatYOU says:

    can some please tell me what time court resumes tia

  94. Susan Moore says:

    Even if we were to accept, arguendo, that the can of tea caused the hoodie to hang away from the chest, how could that can possibly cause the sweatshirt underneath to hang away from the chest?

    • Sophia33 says:

      Exactly. Now let’s hope that the prosecution has enough sense to answer this.

    • whonoze says:

      Probably irrelevant as DiMaio’s analsyis that the gun was 2-4″ from the wound seems solid, and consistent with Bao’s findings. It seems to me that Dimaio’s testimony started with the credible findings and progressed deeper into BS as he went along.

    • Mojo says:

      With the bullet entering, per DiMeo, slightly from Trayvon’s left to right, that would easily suggest the theory that GZ had ahold of Trayvon’s sweatshirt and undershirt on Trayvon’s right side and Trayvon was pulling away to his right when FatAss shot him.

      • Trial-is-underwaybaby says:

        YES… BINGO… I hope BDLR goes there and makes that suggestion so that Dr. D has to say “Yes, that would be consistent as well”

    • pat deadder says:

      Susan Moore ”can of tea caused hoodie to hang away”.And how did fogen get his gun out and shoot straight to back.

  95. smokeegyrl says:

    sorry y’all, I am recording this crap… I don’t know if it is worth recording… I just want to see how Bernie is going to do the cross… I couldn’t watch it. I muted it… and started cleaning my carpet… I am such in a foul mood… I needed to silently pray for guidance and strength to keep it together. Especially to the person up there who gave Fred big ups and then says his blog has gone to “shits” and I took offense to it… didn’t know if it was because all of us were here talking about this case… I guess that started my mood. So, to give give respect to Fred and his blog, I humbled myself and not said anything. *sigh* going back to my corner.

    • Deborah Moore says:

      Take care of yourself, first, then you can help others.
      Cleaning carpets is good.
      I started by mopping the kitchen and that led to washing walls and repainting the baseboards. I know. I’m crazy. What’s new?
      But, I drug my laptop from the LR to the kitchen, so I can listen.
      I know women clean when they are upset. What do guys usually do?

    • chi1224 says:

      Hang in there smokee, it’s hard to listen to this defense garbage, but it will be over soon enough. The state’s case is still strong and intact. It’s normal for the defense to throw out a bunch of red herrings. The jury might have to listen to it but they won’t believe it. Sending you a cyber hug.

    • elle says:

      Smokeegyrl, I have been cleaning my carpets too! And making bread, lots of bread. It really helps when I get agitated.

  96. Stormwatch says:

    There is a plethora of information concerning the fact that the defendants kel tec 9mm has a reputation for excessive recoil. Zimmerman is left handed. He was holding the gun with his right hand (the weaker one) and the gun kicked back and hit him in the face, Damm it so obvious and I’m really disappointed that nobody has mentioned it except West during his opening statement when he made reference to his client’s gun having “A ton of recoil.” Most peculiar.

  97. Jun says:

    Gunshot Wound = not life threatening or threat at all

    Two tiny scratches = death beating was inflicted

    LOL wow at the nonsense this guy says


  98. GrannyStandingforTruth says:

    Dr. Vincent Di Maio is lying his ass off without a conscience. Disgusting!

  99. pork que says:

    Read this>> http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/06/09/1214336/-DNA-Report-does-NOT-support-Zimmerman-s-claim-that-Trayvon-Martin-caused-his-injuries#

    It gives details and SPD pics showing that only the TIP of the killer’s nose was bleeding from two Pinhole injuries to the TIP of the killer’s nose.

    The pinhole injuries could have happened via recoil.

  100. bettykath says:

    but your honor, we don’t have any expert witnesses. We have no money. We have no time. [sob, sob] (behind the hand – sneer)

  101. Tee says:

    He’s doing what he is paid to do, its up to the prosecution to comba his testimony. This is how it plays out in the courtroom you call your expert I call mine. Now what gets me is the I can pull out your heart and you can still walk and talk. BDLR need to play the recording when shot is fired & all sound ceased.

  102. pork que says:

    Could the injuries on the Killer’s head be from his MMA fighting class?

    Could the small cuts on the back of the killer’s head be from his wife cutting his shaven head that night?

    Could someone please explain why only the TIP of the killer’s nose is bleeding (which is consistent with the two pinhole injuries on the TIP of the killer’s nose)

    • Dave says:

      It’s possible that those “pinpricks” are just two points on a shallow cut, mostly invisible in the lo-rez photos.

  103. Stormwatch says:

    Those facial injuries were caused by gun recoil and I’m amazed that the state has not hammered away on that. The two identical sized pinholes at the tip of the nose prove it. The 2 marks are from the “V” shape part of the gun that one aims with. The top of the “V” is what made the two marks on the tip of the nose.

    • PiranhaMom says:

      @Stormwatch –

      Re recoil-caused injuries: YESSSSSSSS!

    • Sleuth says:

      I’ve been saying the same thing last year when the first released this pictures. Whether the State thinks its recoil or not, like you suggested, they need to put that possibility out there.

      Dr. Rao tried to help the State in this regard when she gave a demonstration by closing her fist and placing it on the bridge of her nose, I think the duh-fense objected.

      I believe front and back of head injuries are caused by recoil.

    • Susan Moore says:

      I keep wondering the same thing. It’s clear to me that those 2 punctures came from the two prongs on the gun sights.

    • Lynn says:

      Yeppers. Nostrils weren’t bleeding, the tip of the nose was the only thing bleeding and then Fogen pursed his lips to smear it to the bottom lip.

  104. Trial-is-underwaybaby says:

    EARN YOUR PAY BDLR…. a lot of his testimony was some far fetched shit…..

  105. amsterdam1234 says:

    Bernie is getting ready. That smirk on his face tells you everything.

  106. Bernie has some work to do…hope he brought his A game!

  107. MedicineBear says:

    Anyone think the jury is thinking fogen’s injuries are more and more insignificant the more time they Weat on them?

  108. fauxmccoy says:

    so 6 possible impacts — not that different from dr. rao

    that is NOT 25-30 as the CAC claimed.

    (this is important, it reinforces the state’s case that only 2 people know what happened, one is dead, the other a liar)

  109. chi1224 says:

    For anyone who wants to look at the jury spreadsheet while West drones on and on…


    • Sophia33 says:


    • fauxmccoy says:

      hey! that’s mine! (glad you are still finding it useful – i still refer to it)

      • chi1224 says:

        You did such great work on that Faux, I refer to it quite often 🙂

      • chi1224 says:

        juror B76 continues to be the one I worry about.

        • fauxmccoy says:

          precisely, me too. the thing she said in voir dire that bothered me most was she thought trayvon was out very late. i suspect she knows the truth now and i’ve paid attention to what is said about her on twitter and i’ve maintained hope that she is truly listening, paying attention and taking her job seriously.

          (i have used that same avatar on other boards, i really like it.)

          • chi1224 says:

            7PM is not late… I didn’t like the part about “there was a fight and the gun went off”… Um, no, fogen pulled the trigger.. But like you I am hoping she is doing her job and paying close attention to the facts. What have you heard about her on twitter?
            I’m also thinking E40 might be our foreperson, has jury experience, and reached a verdict.
            ps- glad you like the avatar, we must be like minded 🙂

          • fauxmccoy says:

            just that she paid close attention to the state’s case, took a lot of notes, seemed inquisitive. i will infer that as wanting to get to the truth, which is really all you can ask along with doing your best to set aside any personal bias.

          • chi1224 says:

            Okay thanks, that is good to know.

          • Malisha says:

            “There was a fight and the gun went off” is manslaughter.
            If there was a fight between someone trying to escape and an armed person trying to catch him, however, that’s quite a different matter.

    • My Forehead Tho says:

      So two nurses in the jury? Thank God.

      • fauxmccoy says:

        one is a CNA i think and the other worked in a chiropractor’s office. so not nurses, really – but might have some basic info or seen much worse injuries. of course, almost any mother has tended to worse injuries and any menstruating woman sees more blood on a monthly basis.

    • Jun says:

      i do not understand what the colors mean

  110. whonoze says:

    I hope Manthei does the cross, but I’m sure it will be Bernie. He’d better bring it on this one.

  111. Yorazigo says:

    His smiling & laughing reminds me of GZ on Hannity as he lies. Also how can he diagnose injuries from photos?

    • chi1224 says:

      Yeah, and Fogen saying he had no regrets, and it was “God’s plan”… I am so glad that interview is in evidence. it shows how evil Fogen is, he had no remorse whatsoever for killing a child.

    • fauxmccoy says:

      or west’s knock knock joke.

      i don’t know how anyone could view such a body of material without wondering what the hell is wrong with these people. all of them.

  112. Trial-is-underwaybaby says:

    This shit is ridiculous… he basically is saying TM’s injury was not that painful and he lived long enough to say “You got me”, for GZ to frisk him spread his arms out then move them back in… all in 10 to 15 seconds… and GZ had possible injuries that could have been life threatening this is some bull shit

    • My Forehead Tho says:

      Injuries that didn’t require a bandaid and that he refused to go hospital for. This witness is ridiculous and extremely bias.

  113. Sleuth says:

    BDLR had better ask him if its possible that recoil could be the cause of his face/nose injuries.

  114. Sabrina B. says:

    He keeps saying the photos are bad and washed out. So what exactly did you examine doctor? Have you actually seen these photos or are you talking just off the top of your head?

  115. Wendie Dox says:

    i’d send this hired jerk to hell.. but he already has a ticket after remurdering lana clarkson.

  116. Nellie Nell says:

    Why are these people okay with the murder of a kid? I am at a lost how far people will go to lie for a loser.

  117. MedicineBear says:

    Is the swelling and small laceration on the right side of the nose consistent with the recoil of a hand gun?

    Is it consistent with an ejecting cartridge from a Kel tek PF9?

  118. disappointed says:

    I wonder if fogen feels guilty at all for lying on a deceased minor child at all?

    • elle says:

      He does not feel guilty at all. He is proud, and he cannot figure out why we have not bowed down to worship him yet.

  119. bettykath says:

    omg, fogen was hurt. he’s not guilty.


  120. Jasmine says:

    I am trying to figure out Fogen was conscious after more than 2 hits to the concrete (which we all know did not happen). You know we have all probably hit our heads getting into the car. I have almost passed out from one hit so how did he survive more than 2? Ugh

    • lurker says:

      Four hits on three sides of his head.

      Trayvon must have really been whipping that sidewalk around!

      • fauxmccoy says:

        ‘is that a cinder block in your pocket or are you just happy to see me?’

        armed with sidewalk…. yup yup yup

  121. whonoze says:

    Points to the swelling, but without explaining how GZ’s nose bridge appears collapsed. So, yeah, a total cherry-picking hired gun.

  122. Nellie Nell says:

    Did he just say that the EMT pushed his broken nose back in place???

  123. Sophia33 says:

    I hope that the jury isn’t buying this. The EMT pushed a fracture back in place. Did any of them say that they did this?

  124. fauxmccoy says:

    this guy and west are perfect for each other — ghoulish inappropriate humor.

  125. Stormwatch says:

    I hope at least the nurse on the jury knows how full of shit this guy is.

  126. Two sides to a story says:

    Oh, Lord – that last picture was enhanced to look darker – dark black eyes. What a travesty.

  127. My Forehead Tho says:

    “they pushed it in”

    Really? I can’t with this witness

    • Two sides to a story says:

      That’s a flat-out lie.

      • sadlyyes says:

        he would have SCREAMED BLOODY MURDER,a broken nose would need anasthesia to be manipulated,and where are the black eyes? what nonsense

    • lurker says:

      “consicously or unconsciously”

      Exactly what is he saying about the EMTs?

      • My Forehead Tho says:

        Basically, the reason Fogen’s nose didn’t appear broken in the picture taken from the police station is because the EMT may have consciously or unconsciously pushed his nose back into place.

        • Malisha says:

          If an EMT consciously or unconsciously had pushed Fogen’s nose back into line, he was entitled to shoot them.

          • My Forehead Tho says:


          • pat deadder says:

            After reading comments I don’t need to watch .You all are the best luv the comic relief or this could drive us off the deep end.If I hear one more mention of fogen’s bullshit nose I’m going to blow a gasget.Imho all he did was squeeze it in one side stayed since it was full of snot.My ex used to hit my face I held my hands up for protection even two blows I had black eyes for days.

  128. Sabrina B. says:

    The EMS unconsciously pushed his fracture back in? OMG

  129. bellesouth says:

    EMT pushed his fractured nose back in place?? Yeah, right.

  130. fauxmccoy says:

    so — not really a broken nose … LIKE THE FUCKING DEFENDANT CLAIMED on his reenactment video.

    thanks mr expert, sir!

  131. Woow! says:

    I knew West was going to drag this man’s testimony out to lunch. What a waste of time.

  132. amsterdam1234 says:

    GZ just woke up from his morning nap.

  133. Trial-is-underwaybaby says:

    Notice how he is not incorporating any of the other surrounding evidence from that night.. GZ being coherent and responsive, being able to walk and exit a police car cuffs… he exhibited no signs of serious injury

  134. MedicineBear says:

    Are these minor back of the head lacerations consistent with hard force trauma from the end of a flashlight?

  135. disappointed says:

    I would like to show the defense team blunt force trauma. Where can I mail the photos?

    • willisnewton says:

      hand deliver them, its more friendly.

      • Judy A Vallejos says:

        yes yes do that

        make sure you say hello all you fucking punks/coons
        you all look like your up to no good are you on drugs or something?

        you always get away

        it is accepted normal conversation if we are to believe the dumbass’s friends

        • Mojo says:

          Hey Judy, you fucking punk. Asshole!

          Now, doesn’t that sound friendly and neighborly?

          I wish BDLR could say something like that to West and watch West take offense and then BDLR ask him if it sounded like normal conversation.

    • willisnewton says:

      and don’f for get to use the polite terms, “effing punks” and “A88holes” while you offer them the assistance.

  136. MedicineBear says:

    Are these punctate abrasions consistent with running into bare tree branches?

  137. Boyd says:

    DeMaio is a scumbag. He’s giving the Jury hypothesis and with West driving the show, it’s attempt to describe it as what happened to Fogen. We all have knocked our head into something like falling down. If he was stunned as DeMaio is saying he could have never pulled the gun out and have some recall about it
    Also I did he ever tell anyone he was stunned? They are making stuff up.

    The Fogen lies and West/MOM lies have piled up so much I don;t think the prosecution has the time to blow it all up.

  138. lurker says:

    PLEASE ask him how those punctate wounds consistent with concrete came to be on the front/side of the head if gz was confined to the ground flat on his back!

  139. Puck says:

    Those photos look like the contrast has been altered.

  140. Trial-is-underwaybaby says:

    This is some BS.. this would mean Trayvon picked his head up and slammed him on the top, then on the side… etc… his testimony is some fucking BS..

  141. Sleuth says:

    Dr. D is basically regurgitating what the duh-fense wants in order to make their case. Using phrases such as “a surface with an edge to it”.

    • MedicineBear says:

      Stupid basturd said “edge” when he obviously meant “rough texture”. Guess the duhfence pays him extra every time he uses one of their bonus words(like “sidewalk,” “edge,” “slamming,” “concrete,” “shimmy,” “ground and pound,” etc.).

      • Sleuth says:

        Heck, Mr. Donnelly could be paying him for all we know. You’re right, he’s definitely mirroring the duh-fense’s language.

  142. How does he get punctate injury on the top front of his head if he is on his back?

    • lurker says:


    • Lynn says:

      Break-dancing on concrete. Didn’t you know that Trayvon saying “homie” caused this reaction in him. lol

    • Dee says:

      Because he wasn’t on his back, it started out this way until Tryvon got away from him, yelling and screaming for his life, then Zimmerman caught him by the shirt bringing Trayvon to the ground. Which Zimmerman was now able to get on top of Trayvon. And while still holding on to Trayvon’s shirt, he shot him making the shirt closer to the gun and still far enough away from his chest. Which caused this 4” gap they are talking about.

  143. Patrcia J-C says:

    GZ is sleep. I guess that is residual effect of his head “trauma”. Why isn’t the state objecting to anything? This man is rambling, lying, and making it up as he goes along? They still havent’t mentioned anything about Donnelley being in the court room while the other “witnesses” were sequestered. I do not know how this people sleep at night. I pray their children never encounter someone like wannabe GZ.

    • Patrcia J-C says:

      GZ is sleep. I guess that is residual effect of his head “trauma”. Why isn’t the state objecting to anything? This man is rambling, lying, and making it up as he goes along? They still havent’t mentioned anything about Donnelley being in the court room while the other “witnesses” were sequestered. I do not know how this people sleep at night. I pray their children never encounter someone like wannabe GZ.

  144. ay2z says:

    NTW, how does DeMaio know those abrassions are even abrassions, nevermind punctate injuries, where this could simply be blood wiped and dried in and around hair folicles. After incomplete ‘cleaning’ which was the wiping of the EMT’s at the scene? OBVIOUSLY, the cleaning was not a complete scrub down.

  145. Dee says:

    So could he get this from hitting himself with the back of his gun? Yes

  146. fauxmccoy says:

    oh no, no water…. i’ll take the bourbon neat, please.

  147. MrSykes says:

    The mention of “stunning” is jackpot for the State. Stunning=nowhere near deadly or incapacitating

  148. disappointed says:

    Could those injuries from when Fogen went to bathroom at SPD and pulled a Jim Carey and kicked his own ass?

  149. PiranhaMom says:

    Or, stupid, it indicates Zimerman;s head was dragged over something narrow (but rough) to abrade/cut the skin during that struggle over the ground..

    With the beating DeMaio is describing, could Zimmerman get out of the patrol car less than an hour later without assistance – even with his hands cuffed behind his back, thus impacting his balance?

  150. Dee says:

    West didn’t want to hear tears. So he jumps to something else’s Zimmerman had two tears, for having his head banged repeatedly into the side walk come on, He most likely his himself over the head with the butt of his own gun. However, since they didn’t take DNA of the clip of the gun, we would never know this.

  151. Sophia33 says:

    Sorry, I am cringing with this “stunning” comment.

  152. MedicineBear says:

    Ooooh, I trusted this guy until I saw him start cherry picking only data that will help support fogen’s version. No mention of victim’s lung damage. That would certainly affect the victim’s ability to breathe and talk and move.

    The clincher, though, was his evil smirk to Bernie when he got in “arms could be moved” after the fatal bullet.

    This fuck is another evil reptile smugly supporting the fogen mission of ethnic cleansing — NOT a man of science. He’s a wicked cherry picker with an evil agenda.

    I’ll be interested in how the Angels of Justice work over this Dr. de POS as they work through the Prosecution. I know the Angels are sitting at the Prosecution table.

  153. amsterdam1234 says:

    He is not a good witness.

  154. Sleuth says:

    Can’t believe he’s sitting there sleeping through the doctor’s testimony.

  155. Sabrina B. says:

    Yes, they are cringing because they know you are lying.

  156. Sophia33 says:

    But Zimmerman didn’t have a concussion. I’m sick of hearing about his boo boos. He should have got to the doctor. He didn’t go to a single doctor. And yes, as a medical student, I am cringing at what this fool is saying.

    • Trained Observer says:

      Sophia33 – Have never been to med school but am cringing with you.

      (I believe jurors will focus on one stand-out fact: Fogen never bothered to go to an emergency room or visit a full-fledged physician for examination of his boo-boos. No stitches, no x-rays, no nothin’ ).

      This rest of this stuff is just boring blather and conjecture.

  157. ay2z says:

    I have not been following closely, not the comments either. But listening as I come and go to other things, I have to ask is this all worth it and to anyone other than the defendant?

    Really. Who benefits and what of the costs to a family to go through this?

    There’s some more closure, possibly very little, for the living victims of this killing, crime or not., but is this idea of ‘justice’, needing to hold someone accountable, worth it?

    Who benefits besides persons who have suffered directly with a loss of a child such as this?

    Society benefit by holding this killer accountable? Justice system benefit?

    The family sitting through this worth it for whaever accountability or penalty ‘might’ be adjusded?

    • anita says:

      If fogen is convicted & goes to prison, he can’t kill or hurt anyone else. Possible future victims will benefit.

    • roderick2012 says:

      The family sitting through this worth it for whaever accountability or penalty ‘might’ be adjusded?

      Go back and make a list of George’s previous crimes and see how they have escalated over time.

      It started with his violating his cousin for ten years. Then he turned off his mother’s electricity. From there he assaulted the ABC officer. Then he assaulted his ex-girlfriend. Then there was the road rage incident and now he has murdered a kid who was walking home from the store carrying a can of Arizona soda and a bag of Skittles.

      If George is acquitted how long do you believe it will be before he violates someone else?

      George has proven that he doesn’t respect the personal boundaries of others and if givien a chance he will do it again and again.

    • Malisha says:

      The value of this is that a society MUST say that it refuses to condone certain kinds of behavior, such as murder. It cannot afford to give way on that point, EVER. We, as a society, have given way on most of the important points already (such as allowing government corruption, allowing tyranny in our courts, allowing discrimination in our voting system, allowing wholesale victimization of our children, etc.) We cannot just say, “OH OK, since murder trials are so awful we can just skip them.” That’s like Fogen saying he was sorry to have caused divisiveness in America; he would prefer for ALL of America to back his right to kill. We mustn’t do it.

  158. gwynne says:

    More Grimm’s fairy tales from ice cream man.

  159. Leslie says:

    My gut is telling me that the jury is seeing through the defense, this tactic and this man’s testimony. Seriously idk why, but i just got a tremendeous sense of calm about it.

  160. Wendie Dox says:

    what is his point here? i’m not getting it…

  161. willisnewton says:

    This uplighting seems to suit a cheap villain like West. Real horror show.

  162. disappointed says:

    Yes Fogen sleep through your trial the jury will not notice.

  163. whonoze says:

    Oh-My-O just compared GZ to an abused child.

  164. fauxmccoy says:

    oh, we are back to shaken baby syndrome!

    it’s circular logic, folks!

  165. Sabrina B. says:

    Oh boy, abused children now? Yes talk about no CT scans.

  166. amsterdam1234 says:

    The jury is not going to buy this. They’ve seen the good photos, where dr. Rao was able to point out nevi on GZ’s head on her photos. This stuff makes people lose trust.

    • anita says:

      I sure hope you’re right. When will the state bring up Donnelly was in the courtroom?

    • looolooo says:

      Hopefully the jury will toss all of this medical Mumbo jumbo, and focus on the fact that “Georgie” jumped to his feet, walked, talked, made phone call, sat,stood, lied, relieved >>5<< minutes if medical attention, went to p.d. station, went home, went to Dr., got note, went to school, NEVER went to a REAL DR. for further treatment and an X-ray, made no other medical complaints, and hasn't produced any X-ray's etc to prove ANY serious injuries.

      The jury just needs to focus on those facts.

  167. Jun says:

    After this is the state rebuttal and that’s it right?

    • willisnewton says:

      After this it’s cross examination by the state. When the defense RESTS, then the state gets a period or rebuttal to present arguments and witnesses more directly.

      • Jun says:

        Then the defense goes again, or is the state rebuttal the end, and then it is closing?

        • willisnewton says:

          after rebuttal there are closing arguments. During rebuttal the defense gets to cross examine. The defense gives the final closing argument.

          then the judge gives the jury instructions, such as , “if you find that thus and such happened, then you must rule not guilty” These jury instructions are very important.

          Then the jury deliberates. They can ask the judge questions, and they can review all the evidence but they cannot ask the lawyers for either side additional questions. Then they vote, and only a unanimous decision makes a verdict. They can vote as many times as it takes. If they can never all agree it is a “hung jury” and the state can either conduct a whole new trial or decide to drop the charges.

          at least that’s what I think happens. I’m not a lawyer.

    • Trained Observer says:

      cross, I think.

  168. Woow! says:

    Why is there a lot of negativity on the blog since the defense began their case? The defense has not done anything extraordinary to blow the prosecution case out of the water.

    All they have done in brought forth friends, family and paid shills to support that CAC’s version of events. No proof, no facts.

    Sorry for the rant but are there trolls on here trying to change the positive atmosphere?

    • whonoze says:

      There is good reason to critique the prosecutions case, just as there are reasons to think the State has done enough to win. Different conclusions about how the case is going is to be expected, and is not trolling.

    • chi1224 says:

      I think (for me at least) it’s just hard to listen to the defense attempt to smear the victim, and their non-stop attempts to make fogen the victim. For me, especially the attempts to steal Trayvon’s screams is just very hard to take.
      That being said, I do agree with you that the state’s case is still in tact and I am looking forward to rebuttal.

    • ks says:

      Yes. There has been a wave of incessant negativity about everything. It’s getting to be a bit manic.

    • elle says:

      Woow, we just have no energy because they are boring us to sleep. I have faith. That empty shell wasting good oxygen and taking up 3-dimensional space on our planet is going to jail. No one is going to change my mind. I got a little freaked out yesterday about the toxicology, but everyone reassured me that the jury will see it does not make Trayvon a bad person quickly and I felt better. You are all the best! Thank you. Hoodies up!

  169. disappointed says:

    almost of an inch. oh ok.

  170. Trained Observer says:

    West: What’s the mechanism by which the lacertation occurred . ..

    Ye gods.

  171. Donna says:

    I notice that Grace Zimmerman is not in the court room. Anyone know why?

  172. Sabrina B. says:

    you tear but no scrape? on concrete?

  173. Trained Observer says:

    Oh, yes, by all means. Let’s talk about the curvature of the head. In fact, let’s talk for an hour or so.

  174. Jun says:

    why the fuck is West allowed to lead and use hearsay so much?

    This is bullshit

    If the state asked questions in the same way, it would be so much objections

  175. Wendie Dox says:

    this is the douche that said lana clarkson committed suicide.. what do we expect?

  176. Boyd says:

    The prosecution better turn De Maio into their witness.

    De Maio is making assumptions, and trampling on most of the forensic testimony given by the prosecution experts. Did he say that Martin smash Fogen’s head into the concrete?

  177. Dee says:

    How do we know if his head doesn’t look like this now. Why did he cut his hair as it was so that we could see if his head just doesn’t look like that.

  178. bunny620 says:

    George decided to take a quick nap while the lights are low…

  179. Dee says:

    Notice the blood flow this means he was looking down. As he was bleeding meaning, he was on to top of Trayvon as he was bleeding. Why the prosecution is not noticing this. I have no earthy idea.

    • My Forehead Tho says:

      I’m sure they have. I wonder why they haven’t brought it up though.

    • willisnewton says:

      They can bring that up but GZ was seen rising rather quickly. I don’t think the blood trails are proof of much, frankly.

      I think GZ is a liar but it appears to me that he was on the bottom for a while. That doesn’t mean he wasn’t trying to detain the teen.

      IMO there was never a “fight,” there was instead an attempt to detain vs an attempt to escape.

  180. chi1224 says:

    I hope Bernie asks- why didn’t the EMT’s give the defendant a band-aid? Why were his vitals normal?

    • Lynn says:

      Yes, this “expert” just said blood pressure would be raised in a fight. Heart rate would be well over 100. All of this explaining the blood leaving Trayvon’s heart. But the same could be true for Fogen, yet all his vitals were normal and witnesses said he was calm.

  181. Sabrina B. says:

    bruise on the left side as opposed to shape if head.

  182. willisnewton says:

    No one yet has pointed out to the jury that this is a picture of a man holding a phone to his ear.

  183. sadlyyes says:

    yes animal rescuer here!…Georgie bought the gun,with HOLLOW POINT bullets to kill dogs,or black teens,anything HE deemed undeserving of life,my Da was a medical examiner far smarter,more ethical,never was a hired gun….again these defense teamers are

  184. Trained Observer says:

    Dude thinks he’s so amusing … wonder what expressions the jurors have.

  185. chi1224 says:

    OMG that laughing is sickening….

  186. Sabrina B. says:

    Bernie please, one question. “Do you think that a boy being followed and chased by a man with a gun, doesn’t have a right to defend himself when that man catches up?”

  187. fauxmccoy says:

    oh, i am starting to see the light? everything the defendant said is absolutely true?

    now, how much did your testimony cost, mr. expert?

  188. Yorazigo says:

    If GZ was so “stunned” how’d he get his gun out watch his other hand and pull the trigger?

  189. disappointed says:

    Was that for Bernie about the hair cushion?

  190. Mojo says:

    I’m so dismayed and depressed. This guy, DiMeo, just blew the state’s case away. I don’t think they can recover. Trayvon won’t get justice and this piece of shit, Zimmerman, is going to be even more empowered and will make riches over murdering a 17 year old kid. Sorry to be negative, I’m just calling it as I see it

    • Trained Observer says:

      Why do you think that? To me DiMeo is not playin well. (And apparently he didn’t cut much ice with the Drew Peterson or Phil Spector juries either.)

      • Thrace says:

        LOL, in the Peterson trial he said getting out of a hot bath will make you dizzy. I’ve taken plenty of hot baths and never felt dizzy getting out of the tub. He claimed that’s what happened to Kathleen, then she fell, hit her head, became unconcious and drowned. He brought up the stunning thing about head trauma in that trial too- if you hit your head you’re either going to knock yourself out or be stunned.

    • Woow! says:

      No he hasn’t… all Dr. Di Maio has done is said what the defense wanted him to say. He should be ashamed of himself.

      • mrsdoubtfire says:

        These guys all do it. Henry Lee and Verner Spitz seem to the most high profile offenders. Both gave some way out to Wazoo tesimony in the Michael Peterson trial aka Death on a stair case. The Jury didnt buy it.

    • Lynn says:

      The State just has to ask,
      “You said, SOMETHING pulled the clothing down. Couldn’t SOMEONE have pulled the clothing down? Why does the hole line up with both shirts if the can was just in the outer shirt? If his clothing was so wet when put in the plastic bag the defense has made so much fuss about, wouldn’t that indicate that his hoodie was very wet? Wouldn’t a sopping wet hoodie cling to the body?”

    • elle says:

      Mojo, those creepy smiles are freaking the jury out. This man is acting very strangely. The jury knows people will lie for money.

    • Jun says:

      How do you figure?

      1) This defense witness testified for Phil Spector, claiming the victim committed suicide, and his testimony was proven wrong there.

      2) All he said was consistent. There’s numerous other scenarios it can be consistent, not just Fogen’s story only. Lastly the Dimao did not take into account the misaligned holes, and also the testimony of the other witnesses.

      3) There’s still cross examination and then rebuttal. The state gets the memorable end.

    • cielo62 says:

      Mojo~ Dimaio is full on dung. The jury will understand that he didn’t even look at the body, let alone the autopsy. He sees a few pictures of head bops, gets a large stipend for his ‘expertise” and then makes up a batch of lies.

  191. mrsdoubtfire says:

    Z is certainly getting is money’s worth from this guy… His boo boos “stunned “him…

  192. Deborah Moore says:

    Lieing for Dollars.

  193. willisnewton says:

    wow lookit Bernie. Ive not seen him like that before.

  194. Leslie says:

    apparently fogen didnt get any of this stuff since he didint get an mri or ct scan…out of side out of mind

  195. gwynne says:

    I liked the camera cut to Bernie, assessing this guy. Go Bernie!

  196. lurker says:

    Does he have any actual expertise with live bodies? He is insinuating that gz COULD have gotten an impact injury (stunned) from impacting the concrete.

    Sounds like he is just taking a ramble around conversationally what he might know.

  197. disappointed says:

    So he said Trayvon could be alert 15 to 20 seconds. So in 20 seconds Fogen climbs out from underneath, climbs on top, struggles with Trayvon for his arms (fogen insinuated) to place them at sides AND THEN Trayvon still had time to put underneath before he passes out or dies. Matrix 15 to 20 seconds I suppose.

  198. chi1224 says:

    Fogen didn’t have a concussion either, STFU

    • chi1224 says:

      Nor was he “stunned” STFU

      • abbyj says:

        chi, no he did not have a concussion, nor was he stunned. He hopped out of the police van as if he was heading to a ball game. Then, shortly after, he walked rapidly up the stairway to the bathroom (in violation of policy) without stumbling or any impairment to his gait.


  199. My Forehead Tho says:

    This guy must love seeing and hearing about death. Testing theories out on live animals and smiling about Trayvon’s alleged movements after death is very telling and disturbing,

  200. Boyd says:

    head impact? Okay this is garbage.

    Get in an accident and see what an insurance company has to say about your minor head impact.

  201. Sophia33 says:

    But he didn’t shoot Trayvon Martin on concrete they were on grass. Moist grass. So assuming Zimmerman’s lie is true, Trayvon was banging his head on moist, wet grass!

  202. EveryoneIsEntitledToTheirOpinion says:

    George Zimmerman said he was indigent.. The expert witness aren’t cheap..

  203. Rachael says:

    Then why didn’t he go to the hospital?

    • EveryoneIsEntitledToTheirOpinion says:

      Because his nurse wife fix it up to look worst than it was. This guy wasn’t injured… it was staged bandages placed on his face. If you have been in a fight you are massively bloodied.. Strolling in the police station like they are friends.

  204. J4TMinATL says:

    Dr. Vincent J. Di Maio’s testimony can be properly directed on cross. No worries.

    • Sophia33 says:

      I hope the prosecution at their Wheaties.

    • Eric says:

      Have you seen the state cross? to call it underwhelming is being kind. the theory around here is that the state is going to wait until the end of the fourth quarter to all their touchdown passes and miraclessly win the game.

      • J4TMinATL says:


        What makes you believe I have not seen the state cross examine? That is your theory, it is not mine.

        This IS NOT a game to WIN, unless you are Mark O’Mara.

  205. mrsdoubtfire says:

    Is he about to say Z told lies cos he had brain injuries unspecified.

  206. Sabrina B. says:

    And they die. I wish he did die. Why didn’t he go to the hospital if he was so afraid of death?

  207. MedicineBear says:

    Why no mention of the damage to the lungs? How long could the victim talk or breathe with collapsed lungs are (sorry) suffocating the victim by blood pouring into victim’s esophagus.

    This guy is cherry picking information.

  208. PiranhaMom says:

    If Zimmerman was on the bottom, why was the blood on his head not smeared by the wet grass on which his head “rested” (or was smashed into by the “blows” supposedly inflicted by Trayvon)?

    BERNIE – DeMaio is NOT looking at this “incident” in its TOTALITY.

  209. disappointed says:

    So even though others have said his injuries were not life threatening this douche bag has him getting brain injuries. Kiss my azz.

    • abbyj says:

      disappointed, You said exactly what I was thinking, but you said it in such an elegant manner in contrast to what I was personally thinking.

      “Douche bag” barely covers it when it comes to describing this wretched, murdering, lying, POS, and he can kizz the azz of every person he’s ever caused agony to. That would take him into eternity. I’ll settle for life in prison w/o any hope of parole.

  210. breelee says:

    I personal, if on a jury, would believe the ME who performed the autopsy over one paid to say what the defense wants him to say. I hope we have a smart jury.

  211. degraveegmailcom says:

    Did he see the body of Trayvon martin or is he commenting on

  212. Rachael says:


  213. trina cosbie says:

    So, West just got this pay me & I will say what you want doc to insinuate that Fogen spread his arms, but Trayvon was alive long enough to have put his arms underneath him himself…..although we have several witnesses to attest to this. Prosecution better clean that shit up on cross!!!

    • Sabrina B. says:

      Yet no mud or dirt scrapes to indicate that.

    • gwynne says:

      The prosecution will be ready.
      This guys downfall (imo) is that he loves himself and thinks he’s quite a special gifted man. Why he’s happy to be here to bestow knowledge unto the poorly educated masses.
      The jury isn’t stupid, and we aren’t either.

      • Cercando Luce says:

        When asked 2 hours ago for his name, he replied “Doctor ____ Di Maio, [followed by detailed typing instructions for the spellign thereof].”

  214. Ty Flair says:

    I pray the State is ready for cross the defense is milking everything they can get from this expert.

  215. Sabrina B. says:

    Lost blood pressure too quickly to bruise but, can still fight and talk.

  216. Rachael says:

    You mean the injuries GZ did NOT sustain?

  217. Trained Observer says:

    This cowboy may be a heavy hitter (at least a cut above yesterday’s line-up, but I can’t wait for Bernie to rip into him on cross.

  218. fauxmccoy says:

    oh, so the defendant’s head was soft because you don’t bruise if you hit soft tissue. got it!

  219. chi1224 says:

    You know what you guys, it is extremely likely and even probable in my opinion that the jury is looking at this man and this entire defense with the same disgust we are….. I mean the state has laid out facts. Why would they not believe THEM? All their evidence is “consistent” too, PLUS COMMON DAMN SENSE!!

  220. Dee says:

    Zimmerman is taking notes for next time, make sure you shoot them in the head and not the chest. I feel like throwing up when I look at him and all of these people that are taking up for him. I wonder how much he is making.

  221. Woow! says:

    Asswhipe he supposedly bunched that CAC in the face (hard bones) therefore there should have been bruising.

    • fauxmccoy says:

      yup – caught that. i’d infer that the defendant was soft in the head and ask mr. expert about that.

  222. disappointed says:

    Can BDLR ask his hourly rate?

  223. HeresLookingatYOU says:

    I feel BDLR but today save all the I’m sorrys and dig into that ASS ..make this YOUR witness

  224. Woow! says:

    That doctor need to have his tale drug butt naked through sticker bushes for the lies he is telling. Right after BDLR object did you see him smirk then answer yes about TM outstretched arms?

    • tashatexas77048 says:

      Why wouldn’t TM grab his chest immediately.upon being shot? So he grabbed his chest had his arms stretched out then grabbed his Chest again?

  225. Yorazigo says:

    Says TM would have had 10-15 seconds to move his hands & arms to under his body and BIG SMIRK!

  226. disappointed says:

    Wants the jury to know he only suffered a short time. POS

  227. Rachael says:

    Why the hell was he smiling like that?

  228. You all have thoughtful comments says:

    I am leaving here and going to meditate and send some positive vibes to Sybrina and Tracy.

    Bye for now.

  229. fauxmccoy says:

    why the creepy smile on the ‘yes’ about arm movement?

  230. lurker says:

    Big grin saying that within 15 seconds could draw hands under body.

  231. disappointed says:

    Shoot them in the head. WTF is wrong with this guy?

  232. chi1224 says:

    Fuck you DiMaeo defending a child killer for money…. you suck

  233. fauxmccoy says:

    so trayvon was shot at the ‘T’ then ran 40 feet down the dog walk and fell. got it!

  234. PiranhaMom says:

    How many live animals did Dr. DeMaio test to find out how long they “spoke” after being shot to death?

  235. PerfectlyImperfect says:

    How was he breathing to speaking since the bullet fragmented and hit his lower lung?

  236. Rachael says:

    So then why was GZ trying to restrain him AFTER?

  237. EveryoneIsEntitledToTheirOpinion says:


  238. amsterdam1234 says:

    The moment he started talking about this case, his demeanor and his manner of speech changed. This guy sounds like he is bought.

    • EveryoneIsEntitledToTheirOpinion says:

      Remember the government doesn’t pay much for expert witness like the defense. This is the problem.. Those people get paid to testified.

  239. Thrace says:

    He’s making up numbers now. Lets say xyz……

  240. PiranhaMom says:

    BULLSHIT! DeMaio is NOT accounting for Zimmerman’s grasp on the fabric shirts to DETAIN Trayvon, and Zimmerman’s stretching the fabric away from the target point in order to protect Zimmerman’s own grasping hand.

    Thus the 2″ to 4″ separation of fabric from Trayvon’s chest.

    Zimmerman was on top!

    BERNIE! Nail this PAID huckster!!!

  241. fauxmccoy says:

    oh? the heart rate increases? NOW let’s talk about the defendant’s normal vitals.

  242. Rachael says:

    And how fast was GZ’s heart beating after he shot him?

  243. Deborah Moore says:

    Oh yea, and another thing. If he spoke wouldn’t some of his blood be coming out of his mouth?

  244. chi1224 says:

    I hope some of these jurors followed the Spector case and already know this “Dr” is a nothing but a hired gun. He has no shame nor does he care about the truth.

    • lurker says:

      Phil Spector?

      • chi1224 says:

        He killed an actress in his home, Lana Clarkson, then tried to say she killed herself. DiMaeo testified for the defense. Spector is now in prison, the jury didn’t buy his BS that she committed suicide.

  245. You all have thoughtful comments says:

  246. lurker says:

    Dibao said he was only interested in looking at whether the results were consistent with gz’s story. Opens the door for prosecution to ask if the results are also consistent with OTHER scenarios, not to mention whether gz’s scenario is the MOST likely given the evidence of the autopsy.

  247. PerfectlyImperfect says:

    No one witnessed Trayvon Martin saying you got me or moving at all. So this opposes Zimmerman’s story.

  248. Judy75201 says:

    This case is exactly what I am talking about when I reference “creating” reasonable doubt. It got OJ off and it got Casey off. I think it is a dirty shame it is allowed.

  249. Soulsistawoo says:

    Does anyone know if the animation was allowed in?

    And how is it possible to have an animation considered for admissibility and the voice experts were not, in addition to the fact that the animation is an extremely biased and manipulated narrative; in addition to the fact that the defendant needs to declare his own self-defense.
    This animation and toxicology and donation support witnesses and The Sanford Police Department and the passive prosecution who show signs of protecting or covering for the SPD and LE witnesses for the defendant, both current and former officers of the courts for the defendant… This trial is looking more and more like a kangaroo court and trial… and there are hints of Dread Scott and Emmett Till and any other southern murder case filled with corruption with everyone in the courthouse working towards exonerating a murderer.
    Trayvon’s family is fighting an uphill battle against the Roman Army or this can be compared to
    David vs. Goliath.
    If this beast is allowed to walk… I will be forever changed and walk through this life with a completely new attitude towards this society and its judicial system and how that system views and deals with an African American victims.
    Hoodies Up – Justice for Trayvon Martin

    • whonoze says:

      No decision on animation. Daubert hearing only half done.

    • chi1224 says:

      The defense took so long on the animation the judge made them continue it until this afternoon so Mantei can cross the animation guy.
      That was all they did this morning because JN wanted to bring the jury in.

    • Puck says:

      The animation issue couldn’t be settled because MOM went on for almost an hour and a half. JN was pissed that it took so long and said they’d take care of it at the end of the day.

    • chi1224 says:

      ps- I feel the same way you do as far is IF fogen gets off.

    • Soulsistawoo says:

      My apologies for the way my previous post was typed… It was written in an emotional state… and I am not even listening today, only reading the Blog… Yesterday drained me and the hearings yesterday and today finished me.

      But only for today and My Hoodie is up!

    • Two sides to a story says:

      THe hearing about the animation isn’t over – will continue later. JN was pissed that it was taking so long. Jury waiting.

    • willisnewton says:

      determination on the animations admissibility has not yet been determined. expert to be cross examined by Mantei after jury goes home today.

      as to you comments about kangaroo courts, thus far I’ve not seen that. IMO the judge errs on the side of caution biased to the defense some so as to not allow any grounds for appeal. This is an easy case for the jury to decide, I feel, if the state can prove BARD that the defendant lacks credibility. If they can’t do THAT, then yes, they are corrupt or incompetent. But I have hopes they will totally destroy GZ’s credibility based on certain evidence they have entered. It seems they are WAITING until rebuttal so as to give the defense enough rope to hang themselves with. It’s a deliberate strategy and a somewhat risky one. But if it works it will be very effective.

      But meanwhile we are all nervous and rightly so, given the sad history of race relations in the USA.

    • Soulsistawoo says:

      Thanks everyone for your replies.

  250. degraveegmailcom says:

    All opinion not fact.
    jury might as well stick their fingers in their ears and go lalalalalala.

  251. disappointed says:

    I doubt Trayvon had a reserve of oxygen since he screamed for his life 45 seconds.

  252. Fred O'Cliff says:

    Hi all, just sharing an article about the Doc on the stand that might interest you all. Pretty much a hired assassin.


  253. amsterdam1234 says:

    How again did he establish trajectory from an x-ray? He is not claiming the fact that the damage caused by pieces of an exploding bullet, is how he determined trajectory, I hope.

    • willisnewton says:

      He hasn’t established the methodology of this finding at all, that I heard.

    • MedicineBear says:

      He’s still confirming previous testimony that shot is straight through front to back — there’s just a slight angle left to right indicating killer fired using right hand.

      • amsterdam1234 says:

        But he is using the fact that the right lung was hit to claim there was an angle. The bullet exploded into pieces. There is no exit wound. I don’t believe you can establish an angle from an X-ray, when the angle is so slight, there is no exit wound, and the bullet used was an exploding hollow point.

        • willisnewton says:

          agree – bullet trajectory is found by probing the actual path of the bullet. Hollow point bullets spread out on impact and go every which way. That’s why they are banned by the Geneva convention. It’s a horrific weapon meant not to incapacitate the victim, but to kill them dead. Seems like this speaks to ill will and spite IMO.

          • amsterdam1234 says:

            I thought they needed a probe to establish the trajectory too.
            This guy doesn’t even pretend to take this seriously. He was just making it up as the photos were presented to him.

  254. disappointed says:

    or flat on back and someone pulled the clothes away.

  255. Two sides to a story says:

    Yeah, and when you have a sociopath hanging on to your clothing, trying to aim past his hand, it pulls your clothing down.

  256. fauxmccoy says:

    and those are you only to options folks, either trayvon leaning over cac or trayvon on his back.

    no other obvious choices, dear doctor?

    and the can weighed down the hoodie, but how about the under shirt?

  257. chi1224 says:

    It is also consistent with the shirt being pulled away from the body….. ASK THIS ON CROSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  258. MrSykes says:

    Hmmmmm, OR, the clothing was PULLED away. If the State doesn’t hammer that on cross, this case is over.

  259. J4TMinATL says:

    It’s also consistent with GZ pulling TM’s clothing.

  260. parrot says:


  261. degraveegmailcom says:

    Di Maio is saying Gao’s autopsy is incorrect?

  262. Sabrina B. says:

    Watered the garden and west is still there.

  263. Two sides to a story says:

    Good grief. The defense witnesses can take 4 times as long to say the same things as the prosection witnesses? : /

  264. Sophia33 says:

    He is smiling? Really?!

  265. degraveegmailcom says:

    West wants the jury to believe he was alive long enough to sit up and say “you got me”, then instantly died with no pain.
    Remember what Dr Gao said:”I don’t know,ask him”

  266. smokeegyrl says:

    good morning everybody. Not in a very good mood this morning. Have a good day. I’ll come back if mine changes.

  267. You all have thoughtful comments says:

    Trayvon’s tragic wound according this expert is “101”. How crude.

  268. amsterdam1234 says:

    Those jurors will be missing part of the testimony. There minds will be occupied with ugly pictures.

  269. Sophia33 says:

    He just said that the muzzle was against the body.

  270. disappointed says:

    OMG Live testing on animals? WTF? Hopefully BDLR brings that up for the jury, so they hear it one more time.

  271. Yorazigo says:

    @ PiranhaMom

    Haven’t seen Gracie, don’t think she’s there now. She’s been very visible previously when camera is on lawyers’ podium.

    Is that RZJ in court?

  272. chi1224 says:

    Is he making any points here that help Fogen… I’m not see it?

    • MedicineBear says:

      No — unless cold-bloodedly shooting live animals or live black kids is helps fogen.

      So far,he says 2″-4″ is consistent with someone leaning over — he doesn’t mention it’s ALSO consistent with clothing being pulled away from victim (as clothing is held while victim is trying to pull away).

  273. jodiwankanobi says:

    i think i have to go to sleep now, night all, will check back in if i wake at some time, otherwise see you all tomorrow.

  274. Sophia33 says:

    And remember that the defendant shot a neighbors dog.

  275. disappointed says:

    Did he say the shirt was pulled one way?

    • tashatexas77048 says:

      Now watch cross last for two minutes. BDLR hasnt taken a single note. I. hope he’s not doing cross, how can he with no notes?

  276. degraveegmailcom says:

    This bastard used live animals to reach his opinions on gunshots
    I hope the two pet loving jurors noticed!

  277. Boyd says:

    hold it. Did he just tell the Jury full of animal lovers he test on live animals.

    • gwynne says:

      He did. They aren’t going to forget him, either. He just casually volunteered that he isn’t bothered by killing innocent animals.

  278. MedicineBear says:

    Di Maio says nonchalantly: “I did testing for gun powder tattooing — you have to use live animals for that.”

  279. Dee says:

    This man said he was using live animals for his test, Hell no!!! call Jane Mitchell on this fool.

  280. fauxmccoy says:

    ‘you have to use living animals to do it’

    how many animal rescuers do we have in this group of 6 women? 2 at least by my count.

  281. LiveByTheGulf says:

    A lot of money was spent on defense. Sometimes money buys whatever you want — in politics / elections. Wonder if it works the same way in the courtroom with the jury.

  282. amsterdam1234 says:

    Animal loving jurors, listen up.

  283. Sophia33 says:

    He killed living animals and there are two animal lovers on the jury? Niice!

  284. fauxmccoy says:

    the purpose of this testimony right now is to dehumanize the victim. we are only seeing partial photos of close up sections of ‘the body’ and being spoken to in a dispassionate tone.

    all fucking deliberate.

  285. I don’t see 2 inches by 2 inches…I see uneven distribution with a heavier concentration on the bottom…am I wrong?

  286. chi1224 says:

    he was alive when he was shot, well NO SHIT
    where is he going with this?

  287. MedicineBear says:

    “Clothing and muzzle of gun 2″ – 4″ from TM’s skin” — Di Maio

    • J4TMinATL says:

      Muzzle was 0.5 in- 0.6 in away from body.

      “Clothing was not between between the powder and the skin. Clothing didn’t filter out the powder.”

      Vincent is confirming ME’s testimony (intermediary, intermediate, & loose).

  288. Sophia33 says:

    Did you see BDLR look back at the Martins as if to make sure that they were o.k. with the pictures being shown. Good for you Bernie!

  289. mrsdoubtfire says:

    In the Phil Spector case Di Maio was on the stand for three days. And West did not participate in that trial. lol
    Poor Jury.

    • chi1224 says:

      I didn’t know he was in that trial, who did he testify for?

      • mrsdoubtfire says:

        The Defence. Di Maio testified that the vitcim likely comitted suicide by shooting herself through the mouth.

        • chi1224 says:

          Really? I don’t care how many degrees DiMaio has he obviously has no common sense. I will NEVER believe Lana shot herself in the face in Spector’s home with his gun with her purse on her shoulder.
          And we see where Spector is now! Apparently the jury didn’t believe DiMaio either on that one.

      • Thrace says:

        Spector. He claimed Lana Clarkson was a has been actress who was depressed and shot herself.

        • chi1224 says:

          No that freak Spector killed her, imo.
          We see where Spector is now, enjoying life with no wigs at Corcoran state prison. Too bad the prosecution in THIS case can’t ask DiMaeo what he thought in THAT case…. instant loss of credibility, imo.

          • Thrace says:

            I agree with you. When I read that he testified for Spector and Drew Peterson I knew what he was nothing but a hired gun.

  290. chi1224 says:

    That’s right, because Fogan was holding on to the hoodie. This is common sense, imo.

  291. FactsFirst says:

    AYE YO, I LIKE THIS GUY! He pulled his the shirt to the SIDE!!! Did y’all peep that?

  292. jodiwankanobi says:

    oh my God he was alive when he was shot….best $50k the defense ever spent….smh

  293. Christopher Charles says:

    I understand that the defense is obligated to provide fogen with the best possible defense available; I have no problem with that. I am troubled by their attempts to win an acquittal for fogen through lies, deceit, deception, vilifying and demonizing TM. Their actions are not only ugly and shameless, they are also scary and dangerous. fogen admits he killed TM. There is nothing he can say or do to justify the murder of TM. He is GUILTY of murder and he should experience the consequences of his guilt.

    If fogen escapes prison, we are all in danger. I fear killings will increase, not only in Florida, but also across the nation because gun nuts will feel that they can claim they were in fear of great bodily harm or being killed. No one will be safe anywhere at anytime.

    fogen is evil incarnate. His mission is to kill and destroy as many people as he can. I hope Karma has started her perfect work on him.

  294. My Forehead Tho says:

    “We’ll talk about that more”= “Oh shit, let’s move on”

    • fauxmccoy says:

      that would be the state’s clue to probe on that issue — it’s what o’mara and west both do to avoid discussing something. very telling.

  295. chi1224 says:

    West wants the jury to believe he was alive long enough to sit up and say “you got me”, then instantly died with no pain.

  296. Nef05 says:

    Cherry picking for defense confirmation bias. BS!!!

  297. Is he helping West? or not?

  298. chi1224 says:

    When West speaks his voice causes one to zone out with his slow speaking and the way he goes on and on. I don’t see how this is effective at all, the jury will be too zoned to even know what he is talking about. I’m very serious on this. He is horrible. I have no idea how he had a career before this. He sucks.

  299. fauxmccoy says:

    so, for an undisclosed sum of cash, i’ll vouch for any defendant ….. groovy :/

  300. Sleuth says:

    I just think this is all so strange. Official ME report stated the trace amounts of THC in Trayvon’s system may have been there weeks prior, and most likely would not have had any effect. Then changed his mind 6 months later AFTER coming across new information.

    Makes me wonder if he might have stumbled upon some of Dr. DiMiao’s (sp) work.

    • J4TMinATL says:

      The ME consulted with toxicologist, Antoine (Tony) Brooks

    • BillT says:

      i dont think that was his testimony, he said he had changed his mind about the possibilities BUT clearly said he had not changed his mind about Martin……when west tried to put words in his mouth he said, no those are YOUR opinions, my opinion is it may have an effect and it may NOT have an effect.

    • Sleuth says:


      Thank you both for clearing that up for me.

  301. chi1224 says:

    Is he discrediting the witness statements?

  302. chi1224 says:

    Oh he mentioned EMT records…. PLEASE ASK ABOUT VITALS!!!

  303. Sophia33 says:

    You know the defenses propensity to go on and on and on is going to hurt them in my opinion. If Guy can give a closing as crisp as he did in the opening and the if the defense keeps talking for talking sake in the closing, it will be good for getting a conviction.

    • HeresLookingatYOU says:

      People do zone out when folks drone on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and you get the picture

  304. disappointed says:

    John Good again. Documented liar.

  305. Ty Flair says:

    Who will do the cross for the State.

  306. HeresLookingatYOU says:

    Good to hear ! @ SouthernGirl2 thank U

  307. Judy A Vallejos says:

    yes I also see the guy that tried to get Mr Martin thrown out of the court room just above ass wipe uhhh… I mean west’s right shoulder

    how is it that he is there considering that he was… LOL… “threatened” or mis-spoken too?

    no credibility to his testimony? jerk

    I wish Tracy would have clocked him…

    Tracy and Sybrina are of my most admirable people in the whole world as I would be in jail already for not having the strength they have shown

  308. Woow! says:

    Yesterday, did MOM ask the educational background of all those witnesses that testified they heard that CAC scream on the 911 tape? No he did not. Why did they need to know the educational background of all of the prosecution witnesses?

  309. pork que says:

    why are they at the judge’s desk?

  310. Dee says:

    Just say it professor the State is not going to get a conviction, because they have not so for proved their case. They have missed many chances which I myself think, that they are doing on purpose. I really think all of this is just to appease the black race. Making them to believe that they gave Trayvon a fair trial. However, it’s not because they are all working in this world together, and everything they need to prove that point is in their possession.

    Blacks will continue to kill up themselves. And those that would have made it through that, would be killed eventually by the white man’s laws will get the rest. Like this law that allowed Zimmerman to shoot and kill Trayvon an un armed kid holding skittles and an ice tea, dispose of him like trash without a worry in the world. Be careful your kids will be next. Because if this man walks they would have proven that their law is working just as they wanted it to do. Protect the white skinned and allow them to destroy those that are not like them off of the face of the earth. Because he their mind this world belong to them and them only. Therefore we have to deal with our children getting shot down like animals in the night by people such as Zimmerman a minority that knew how to work the white mans law of stand your ground.

    • You all have thoughtful comments says:

      Valid points

    • Judy A Vallejos says:

      all respect to you Dee but Trayvon does not need a “fair trial”

      • LiveByTheGulf says:

        What do you mean? Trayvon doesn’t deserve justice?

        • Judy A Vallejos says:

          yes of course

          Trayvon was not doing anything wrong to be on trial for is all im saying

          I feel he was murdered by zimmerass flat out murdered for being black this is it in a nut shell

          my opinion only from what I have seen here

          zimmerass is a wannabe cant amount to nothing asshole trying to prove his “greatness” above all others

          I hope he goes to jail and rots below the foundation of it long after it is gone

    • EdgySF says:

      That’s a serious allegation. I agree the state is in a pickle because of the incompetence of the SPD, but I don’t believe they have conspired to lose this case.

      The whole world is watching.

      Also, lawyers care very much about their own careers. Nobody wants to lose a high profile case.

      “Blacks will continue to kill up themselves.”

      What are you saying? And what does it have to do with Fogen?

    • Danita says:

      Im sorry to say Dee just might be right. This prosecution has dropped the ball alot. They had the same opportunity as the defense to hire specialist’s and have not done so. They have not proven their case beyond reasonable doubt.This medical examiner is taken the whole case a part and they went and got the guy who wanted to argue beyond reason and change information upon testifying come on give me a break this is going south faaaast……just sayin

      • cielo62 says:

        Danita~ then you are near sighted. Have you thrown out ALL the other evidecne we have seen so far? So they have one liar “expert” who can comment that “maybe” those booboos could be life trheatening. OK. But there’s still the entire lack of DNA on Trayvon’s hands, the scream ending at the gunshot, the misalignment of the bullet holes (NOT the shit he was talking about that they were off to the side BUT that the shirts aligned TO EACH OTHER and NOT to a straight front to back shot. No, this case is just going through what you should expect. On cross, prosecution will nail this lying SOB to the IMPOSSIBILITY of the things gz asserts.


  311. Jurors in 2012 Drew Peterson trial and 2009 Phil Spector trial disagreed with Di Maio and found defendants guilty.


  312. Puck says:


  313. Sophia33 says:

    This is going on and on and on. Get to the point!

    • My Forehead Tho says:

      Right, I hear the words, but i’m not listening. I wonder if West and this witness are having the same effect on the jurors.

  314. MedicineBear says:

    Next Westingtime will have Dr. Di Maio read all 3 of his books to the jury — pausing to answer questions. of course.

  315. Sophia33 says:

    Is he still going through his resume?!

  316. Sleuth says:

    Okay Wiester, we’re convinced about his creds, let’s move it already.

    • Deborah Moore says:

      No! I want to hear about each and every one of his boy scout badges.

      • Sleuth says:

        Well hang in there with us a little longer. Little birdie told me it’s about to start to get real good. This afternoon the good ole doc is going to testify about the guppies he’s breeding.

  317. silk says:

    hay every 1. should this be a mis-trail?? it seems that judge nelson and the defense is not making any since . u have a defense sitting in court , and this bullshit cartoon thing . yet the audio expert was denied. idk . the screams stop when the shot was fired.

    • fauxmccoy says:

      let’s wait for a ruling. judge just delayed the rest of the daubert hearing until they get the jury out for the day.

  318. Beverly says:

    I think this is ‘over-kill’ if I can use that word; he undoubtedly is qualified…..

  319. Deborah Moore says:

    Have you ever worked on the moon, Dr.
    Sorry, all. My head’s going to explode.
    I know. Mopping the kitchen will make me feel better.

  320. Yorazigo says:

    He’s a “jack of all experts” – knows about head injuries, mold, gunshots, etc., etc.

  321. Dave says:

    He seems to be claiming that this small cloud of gas will burn through two cotton sweatshirts before the bullet even gets there. I’d like to see that demonstrated..

    • fauxmccoy says:

      so guns don’t kill people and people don’t kill people, it’s those damn gas clouds!

      • jodiwankanobi says:

        so fogen just let of gas perhaps?

      • MedicineBear says:

        I expect that he can testify on all the forensic evidence, so the State can use him to support the Truth of the case.

        I’m anxious to hear his assessment of the evidence from the killer’s hands and GZ’s blood toxicology from that night.

        Maybe the State can ask him about getting GZ toxicology information from GZ’s blood on Trayvon’s shirt or GZ’s blood that is still on GZ’s jacket and shirt front.

        • Leslie says:

          That’s a good one Medicinebear! I don’t know if that is possible but that is a GREAT idea and question!

  322. thank you Dr. for the detailed description of how dangerous a bullet wounds to the chest!

  323. Nef05 says:

    But fogen acknowledged hollow points, so this is irrelevant.

  324. My Forehead Tho says:

    So the Defense’s defense is to:

    1. Establish that bacteria and rain discriminate when it comes to who’s DNA they get rid of.

    2. Establish that bullets can travel through solid inanimate objects without touching them.

    3. Establish that weed can cause a teenager to snap and attempt to kill a man.

    Did I miss something?

  325. Woow! says:

    Does anyone know if Kieth Olberman is back on the air? He may have been a little crazy but he had no problem calling BS. I would love to see him report on this case.

  326. Nef05 says:

    Seriously? We haven’t even gotten to the actual case!. He’s going to be here a day or more… sigh.

  327. chi1224 says:

    Does anybody know what the defense will try to elicit from this witness?

  328. lurker says:

    Actually, I wonder if he might not be a real bonus for the prosecution. They were pretty much stuck with the ME’s report, since he is the official who performed the autopsy.

    Interesting discussion last night on Chris Hayes about the politics of who is lined up on which side in this case. The folks who are typically skeptical of the established authorities are in this case pushed into reliance on them (even though SPD may be highly, or partially, corrupt). While many typical flag-waving patriots who support established authority are now questioning the quality of the ME’s report and so forth.

  329. Trial-is-underwaybaby says:


  330. Two sides to a story says:

    This credential talk talk is taking far too long. The prosecution didn’t take a long time on this portion of testimony except in the Frye hearings.

    • Woow! says:

      W and MOM drag out questioning with irrelevant BS to confuse the jury. I hope those ladies see through all of that.

  331. Tzar says:

    ha ha ha poggy plant in in the audience

  332. Di Maio is a heavyweight.

    My problem with the cutting edge technology discussed this morning is that it cannot tell us where the defendant was.

    We only have his word for where he was and his lame excuses for being where he claimed to be.

    Putting a pretty bow on the evidence admitted in this case regarding the defendant’s location is basically useless and creates a risk of appearing to legitimize the defendant’s false statements.

  333. lurker says:

    OK–now he’s on to distance. They are going to narrow down the distance of the shot. Bao cited something like 2″ to 4′–which is based solely on the stippling. However, the contact with the clothing realistically narrows it down to the stretch limitations of the fabric. IOW–4′ is not possible.

    I believe he is also supposed to talk (according to O’Mara yesterday) about the angle of the bullet and lead into all the possible scenarios that included gz flat on his back with Trayvon above him. Should open the door for the Prosecution to ask about other possible scenarios, such as face to face standing, or gz standing over Trayvon.

  334. Yorazigo says:

    Five hours to go through his CV

  335. J4TMinATL says:

    Here we go back to July 5 testimony when West opened hole in state’s case about wet clothing and DNA degrading and mold smell.

  336. lurker says:

    OK–he’s going after the SPD for having put the stuff in plastic bags.

    Hope the prosection asks if ALL DNA would be equally likely to degrade and disappear, not just the stuff that might boost the defendent’s case.

  337. Rachael says:

    I think there is a problem with technique – WHY WASN’T THE SHOOTER TESTED? Why do you get the toxicology results on a dead kid and NOT the one who shot him????!!!!!

    • Sophia33 says:

      I know right?!

    • gwynne says:

      maybe they smiled, winked, and invoked the local social acquaintance exception rule (roll eyes)

    • Woow! says:

      Normally you would but we are talking about SPD, known to have bias towards minorities.

    • Dee says:

      They did not get anything from Zimmerman that night. One because they knew him, from going there all the time. Remember he wanted to be a cop, so of course he would be hanging around them. This is also why Zimmerman didn’t get an attorney, because he knew that these cops would believe him, because this man knows about the law. So since they believed him concerning the shooting. They did not take any test from him, not even an alcohol test, drug test of any of tests.

    • willisnewton says:

      “police missteps” is the phrase the pulitzer prize wining investigative NYT reporter used.

      Absent a credible outside investigation we are making guesses as to why he was not tested for drugs or alcohol. As important, possibly was the fact that his vehicle was not found/ searched / impounded. An open container of liquor for example would have been probable cause to test him.

  338. Puck says:

    As I posted in a reply to disappointed above,

    THIS is a good time for the State to bring up the button. Had they done that with their ballistics expert during their case-in-chief, it I don’t think it would have had the impact that it would in a cross-examination of de Maio (sp?). THIS is the guy to catch in a Perry Mason moment.

    • willisnewton says:

      Seems to me the gun slid under the button, which likely has the pin at the top. That idea supports the idea that TM was on top, the button hanging down vertical while the body was at a slant, and I doubt the prosecution wants to go there.

      What is your specific argument? It could be that the button flapped up as he was yanked towards the gun, for example. But the argument seems a wash to me.

      • Tzar says:

        I think the pin was horizontal
        and that would put TM on the bottom or at the least put Zimmerman’s firing hand at the level of the shot

        • Tzar says:

          by pin I mean “latch pin”

          • willisnewton says:

            Now I’m confused. Was the teen horizontal? was the button itself horizintal or vertical? And mosst importatnly, is there any proof it happened ONLY this way? It seems to me it could be many ways.

            Many things are possible. What GZ claimed happened in other areas is not possible.

        • Puck says:

          Buttons that size tend to have pins in the center, otherwise they’d flop around all the time.

          • Tzar says:

            I know
            if the pin was across the horizontal diameter of the button, and the bullet hole is behind the button and above the latch pin (if it is indeed at he horizontal diameter) and given the straight front to back trajectory then Zimmerman’s hand was at the level of the trajectory, this contradicts Zimmerman’s description of his hand location when the shot was taken.

  339. Nef05 says:

    How does he think that fogen’s DNA gone, but Trayvon’s isn’t – is a winning argument

  340. Two sides to a story says:

    Um, here they go on the mold defense again.

  341. Yorazigo says:

    Here to destroy DnA testimony re packaging

  342. PiranhaMom says:

    Fogen’s sister Gracie not in courtroom???

    Removed for texting yesterday when Fogen brought up Donnelly issue?

    Her cell phone subpoenaed?

    Texting her parents from the courtroom?

    Or maybe just out in the loo after all that tomfuckery (thanks, Fauxy!)about the proposed infomercial?

    • Yorazigo says:

      Saw her come in with GZ at 8:30

    • Trained Observer says:

      Stutzman, Pipitone and others are texting from courtroom, so I don’t see why she couldn’t since she’s apparently not a witness. Probably just the tomfuckery … I assume the plural form (must check with Faux) for other issues including Donnelly would by tomfuckerae.

    • fauxmccoy says:

      heh heh heh — i must say, that phrase has just delighted me

  343. Boyd says:

    Now this guy is here to further destroy dingbat Dr. Rao. If this guy gets off because of Rao I’ll lose it

    I love this site.

  344. Sophia33 says:

    JN needs to breathe. She is about to snap. Tell me, why would you want to piss of the judge if you are the defense?

    • Woow! says:

      Because she allow the defense to disrespect her. I think that if she would have smacked them down more when they first began their shenanigans they would have more respect for her court room.

    • willisnewton says:

      If the judge does or says anything that shows extreme or perceived bias, the defense can file a motion about that and an appellate court board of some kind can replace the judge. THis happened to the last Judge, Judge Lester who spoke about the defendant’s lack of respect for the court when the incident regarding hidden money (six figures ) and a second passport was hidden from the court.

      For this reason alone the defense has been pushing the Judge’s buttons the whole time, IMO. It’s a chance at a mistrial.

      Also, they are tone-deaf to some degree about what’s appropriate in general as to behavior in court IMO.

      • Two sides to a story says:

        You’re absolutely right on all this, Willis. She’ll tolerate some nonsense to avoid trouble down the road.

      • fauxmccoy says:

        thank you willis. was gonna mention the lester issue. nelson is erring on the side of caution and i will not fault her on that.

      • Sleuth says:

        Oh really, I thought it was due to her having a rep for allowing thugs, and the well connected to rule the courtroom. My bad.

        • willisnewton says:

          we shall see, we shall see.

          • Sleuth says:

            She’s done it before. I do pray it doesn’t happen this time. In central white thugs and the well connected do rule. Case in point William Taafee (deceased) and the current thug that’s on trial for murderering an unarm child.

            To that list I’ll add a couple of more. Bryan Ansley, Justin Collison, and Timothy Tuchnosky(?).

          • Sleuth says:

            Ooops! meant to say, “in central Florida”

      • abbyj says:

        Willis, agreed. I can feel it, too. JN doesn’t want to get anywhere near the uproar caused by Judge Lester–who simply got removed for telling the truth about GZ being a snake of a liar and disrespecting his courtroom. JN may eventually say her piece and speak her mind, but she’s not going to shoot out dragon flames unless she knows she’s on firm ground. It’s painful to watch her extraordinary cautiousness, though.

  345. Puck says:

    The rat-faced Fogenfriend who tried to get Tracy kicked out is there. I also saw him last week.

  346. disappointed says:

    Ouch West. Give him head phones.

  347. Sabrina B. says:

    TM’s MJ in his system. The gun. The bullet.

  348. willisnewton says:

    I’m going out for some breakfast. This is going to be a long morning.

  349. lurker says:

    OH, Lordy, West is leading off. This should take all morning.

  350. chi1224 says:

    Does anybody know what Fogen was agreeing to before the jury came in?? When the judge had to question him?

    • amsterdam1234 says:

      We all would like to know that. De Maio is not going to testify about certain areas.

    • willisnewton says:

      This witness, an expert on gunshot wounds is going to speak about what he thinks about the forensics. GZ was asked if he was aware that the case has been subject to certain motions that limit what can be talked about. I think this is probably the fact that the defense managed to keep his psych meds out of the scope of the topics that can and may be discussed.

      He agreed, and the case moves on.

      It means he knows that DiMayo (sp) won’t speak about GZ’s ADHD, etc. as we’ve been noticing. GZ mentioned his ADHD to Serino but when they played the tape that part was edited out.

  351. disappointed says:

    If he is going to talk about gun shot maybe he will tell us how the gun shot did not go through the button.

    • Puck says:

      Now THIS is a good time for the State to bring that up. Had they done that with their ballistics expert during their case-in-chief, it wouldn’t necessarily have the impact that it would in a cross-examination of a defense witness.

  352. disappointed says:

    Damn it another old timer. This really could go on for days.

  353. You all have thoughtful comments says:

    That looks like the kind of hat the Southerners all used.

  354. chi1224 says:

    Put down that hat FOOL!

  355. Woow! says:

    Woow a Texas Cracker

  356. amsterdam1234 says:

    And now to cheer JN up, we get West.

  357. groans says:

    Jose Padillo – are you here for Di Maio?

  358. fauxmccoy says:

    this is gonna be grueling

  359. disappointed says:

    I see defense did not drag out Fogen’s jacket. I guess they have no desire to ask about the blood on the back of it?

  360. chi1224 says:

    I am really pissed rat face got to go on and on for hours on that animation BS and nothing was done about Donnelly!! What a bunch of BS… God, now West….. this sucks!

  361. Elizabeth says:

    I could hearTrent Saywer typing furiously in the background just now.

  362. J4TMinATL says:

    Yes that is correct lurker regarding Mr. Demaio’s testimony

    Is that JR. in the court room?

  363. amsterdam1234 says:

    JN sounds really snippy. Banging her files on the desk.