Why Were Mark O’Mara and Don West Smiling?

Tuesday, February 5, 2013

Happy Birthday Trayvon!

As I predicted, Judge Nelson denied the defense motion to continue the trial date. You might think MOM and Don West would be angry and depressed but they were smiling and laughing. If you tuned in right after the hearing ended, you would have thought they won. I explain below why I believe they are delighted with the outcome.

I do not deserve any credit for accurately predicting her decision because the outcome was obvious.

The motion was a smoke-and-mirrors effort to provide cover for the real reasons for the continuance. The real reasons were MOM wanted more time to troll for dollars on the internet and to continue trying his case in the court of public opinion.

Judge Nelson cut him off in mid argument and asked him to give a specific reason why he needed the continuance. He could not do it because Judge Nelson knows bullshit when she hears it.

She read him her order setting the trial date and reminded him that he had agreed to the June date. Then she denied his motion.

Her order likely is not appealable because it would be an interlocutory appeal, which is prohibited subject to a few specific exceptions that do not apply.

Interlocutory appeals, BTW, are mid-stream appeals. That is, appeals filed before the trial court enters a final order disposing of the case after sentencing. Appellate courts do not want to deal with piecemeal appeals taken from orders that do not dispose of a case.

However, even if the Court of Appeals agreed to consider an interlocutory appeal from Judge Nelson’s denial of the motion to continue the trial date, it would have to affirm her order because MOM did not provide a specific reason why the continuance was necessary.

MOM got frustrated with her and blurted out that the defense does not have any experts, but that is not a basis to continue the trial date because there are still four months to go before trial and the defense has had almost a year to get some experts on board, but failed to do so despite having well over $300,000 in internet contributions.

That they might have spent their money unwisely is not the court’s problem.

What happens now?

Unless a billionaire or two provide adequate seed money, and why would they with this hopeless mess, MOM is going to have to file a motion seeking an order that would declare the defendant indigent and allow him to proceed in forma pauperis (i.e., as a pauper).

Under the circumstances with the defense nearly out of money and probably on the hook for the $27,000 owed to AIS, I think Judge Nelson would grant the order. If so, the Court would appoint and pay for an attorney and reasonably necessary costs for investigation and expert witnesses.

Here is where the situation gets a little less predictable. Whom will Judge Nelson appoint to represent the defendant. He gets no say in the matter, BTW.

But for Florida having recently passed a law prohibiting private counsel from being appointed to represent an indigent defendant who ran out of money after retaining them, I would expect Judge Nelson would have been inclined to appoint MOM or West because appointing new counsel will almost certainly require continuing the trial date.

Although both lawyers have claimed that they have not taken a cent for the time they spent working the case, and that might arguably mean that the statute does not apply to them, they have spent money to acquire new office equipment. For example, MOM has spent $40,000. That probably disqualifies them from being appointed.

I think there is a much more persuasive reason why Judge Nelson will not appoint them. They do not want to be appointed.

If you have not done so, watch the hearing with the sound off and study their body language. If you do not want to watch the whole thing, fast forward through it and watch what happens after Judge Nelson declares the Court is in recess.

MOM and West are all smiles and acting like they won the hearing. They stand with their backs to the seated glum defendant, ignoring him. BDLR’s second chair comes over and briefly tugs on MOM’s sleeve to get his attention and they share a little joke and laugh. Then MOM and West pack-up their stuff and leave without apparently saying anything to the defendant who continues to stare glumly at the table.

He remains there silent, still and alone, except for MOM’s assistant, the blonde lawyer from his office whose role appears to be to babysit him. She hovers nearby until the bailiff approaches him and tells him to leave. They leave together, but her body language suggests she cannot abide him. No surprise there.

I think the real winners today may have been MOM and West who now appear to have a face-saving ticket out of the case.

Given their indescribably toxic and unpleasant client, I think this might be the best news they’ve had since they got involved in this nightmare case.

Could even be the best news they have ever heard.

551 Responses to Why Were Mark O’Mara and Don West Smiling?

  1. xy11xy says:

    Wow again!

    So they milk George like a cow for 40 grand in office equipment and exposure, then hang him out to dry…..

    Of course he was crying! I would cry too.

    • Xena says:

      Hi xy11xy. Love your videos.

      The court’s denial of the continuance would cause GZ to cry, because it means he has fewer months to try and raise money and he barely has enough now to cover his living expenses for 3 months. IMO, GZ could care less about the costs of expert witnesses and O’Mara’s fees. GZ screwed the attorney in his civil case when he was suppose to pay him. O’Mara said “pro bono” so GZ doesn’t intend on paying him a dime.

      • That puts MOM between a rock and a hard place. He has an ethical duty to vigorously represent his client’s best interests and that means he needs a consulting expert and an investigator, at the very least.

        But his client apparently disagrees, because he wants to spend the balance of the Peter Pan money on his own expenses. He refuses to apply for leave to proceed in forma pauperis, which is the only way to pay for the expert and the investigator.

        That’s a helluva ethical problem and an avoidable one, if only MOM had taken control of his client early in the case.

        He and his client have only themselves to blame and I am not sympathetic for either of them.

        More important, I’m pretty sure Judge Nelson has no sympathy either.

        • Xena says:

          He and his client have only themselves to blame and I am not sympathetic for either of them.

          It’s all God’s plan. At his press conference after the hearing on 2/5/13, O’Mara, speaking about his own financial resources, said that he didn’t have money for expert witnesses and more depositions. Then he went into the yada, yada about GZ and ShelLIE not having money for living expenses if the court finds GZ indigent.

        • racerrodig says:

          I just keep seeing this Manson like grip Fogen has on O’ Mara and makes references to the attorney that disappeared in his own way. I may be way off, but I just think he has O’ Mara scared to death.

          I have never seen a client, nor any outside source run the show like this case. Every lawyer I know would tell his client stay off the TV, off the internet, tell you brother STFU, tell daddy and mummsie to stay out of this and I’m, that’s me, your lawyer, the only one who talks unless you are asked a question under my supervision in court.

          But, that’s just me.

          • You aren’t alone. Every lawyer I respect is the same way.

          • racerrodig says:

            Now I see a Motion filed yesterday for 3 years of voice recordings by Dee Dee and her alone of Trayvon’s voice.

            The funny part is “2 Mr. Zimmerman has involved himself in the discovery process…..” Uh Oh !! What’s up with that proclamation.

            Is this a statement like “….hey your Honor, this wasn’t my idea…” or

            “FogenPhoole thinks he is in charge and we may be bailing soon”

      • xy11xy says:

        Hello Xena.

        Thank you for the support.

        I was thinking about the money situation last night. If I understand correctly, when he’s declared indigent and an attorney is appointed, he gets nothing for living expenses. That puts him in a very tough spot.

        I wonder about the NBC suit though. Will O’Mara continue to handle that? It seems impossible to draw a straight line from hearing a clip on NBC, coming to the conclusion – upon hearing that clip alone – that George is racist, then taking specific action to injure George because he’s racist.

        • Xena says:


          I was thinking about the money situation last night. If I understand correctly, when he’s declared indigent and an attorney is appointed, he gets nothing for living expenses. That puts him in a very tough spot.

          Based on O’Mara’s media statements, it appears that he believes that the court will not find GZ indigent as long as he has an open trust fund receiving money. That is logical, because there is nothing preventing donors from increasing their donations after he is declared indigent, and I can’t see the court wanting to act a quasi-guardian over GZ’s donations.

          I wonder about the NBC suit though. Will O’Mara continue to handle that?

          O’Mara is actually nothing more than a paper pusher with that case — he is local counsel because the case is filed in Florida by counsel out of PA. The last I checked, no summons have been returned, neither is there a filed waiver of service, so it’s likely that none of the defendants have been served — the case is going no where.

          The NBC edited tape did not cause anyone to believe that GZ is racist. GZ’s own profiling and words conveys that he’s racist. The dispatcher did not ask that GZ confirm Trayvon’s race. GZ had already said “He looks black” and subsequently, voluntarily confirmed “And he’s black.”

  2. jm says:

    Jun: An apology is admitting the wrong you did to someone and asking for forgiveness and showing regret…

    I don’t think GZ is capable of admitting he did anything wrong or has any regret as evident on Hannity interview.

    He is a sociopath and if he has any regrets at all it is because he is looking at the rest of his life in prison, not for killing someone and the pain and suffering he has caused others. He needs psychiatric help but instead GZ gets further enabled by his family (in particular Junior) and “friends” (Osterman, Taaffe, squirrels at the treehouse)

    • Lonnie Starr says:

      And Chief Bill Lee and Prosecutor Wolfinger.
      Too late for him to change now, he’s already taken a life and that’s consider very serious today.
      |||=> Tick Tock! <-|||

      • jm says:

        @ Lonnie

        Love your |||=> Tick Tock! <-|||

        I am sure that is what GZ is hearing as he stuffs more pizza in his mouth to muffle the Tick Tock sound and why he looks so haunted with the dark circles around his eyes.

        • fauxmccoy says:

          tick tock — rather edgar allen poe, tell-tale heartish
          me likey 🙂

        • racerrodig says:

          It’s a shame we don’t have an address. We could send him lots of special calendars with all those warm and fuzzy pictures of dogs and cats, birds, Mother Nature in all her glory, antique cars, Classic and muscle cars, I’ll send him one from my shop & a free complimentary pen and all those calendars will have June 10th marked “Justice Date”

          We can send him case loads of Skittles and hoodies for the cold nights.

  3. SearchingMind says:

    Dumb dumb West

    I found it comical that Donald West found it necessary to read out a statute to Judge Nelson and in effect teach her the law.

    When West consequently argued that the defense, according to the letter of the statute he cited, does not require the leave of Court to depose Crump I thought this guy is willfully being idiotic as I asked myself:

    Ok Mr. West, there is NO law obligating Mr. Crump to appear at your deposition (Crump is not listed as a witness). if you don’t need courts leave to depose Mr. Crump, what exactly are you going to do if Mr. Crump refuses to appear for your deposition? Are you then going to motion the Court to compel Mr. Crum to submit to deposition? If not, what other remedies do you have? If yes, aren’t you effectively asking the leave of Court in order to depose Mr. Crump? Wouldn’t the Court be right in ruling as follows: “Mr. West, you do not need the Court’s leave to depose Mr. Crump. Your motion to compel is denied”? And what if the Court rules as follows: “Mr. West, the Court has considered your motion and finds that deposition of Mr. Crump is unnecessary. The motion to compel is therefore denied”? Are you not back to where you started.

    Mr. West, grammatical interpretation of the law is NOT the best interpretation of the law. I guess in Law School, you were thought different methods of interpretation among with the teleological plays a dominant role. And oh, NEVER teach the Judge the law! It is an unwritten LAW. That much you surely must have learnt in Law School, no? Dumb, dumb West.

  4. leander22 says:

    Ok, two links don’t work: For one of them you have to google: “What Happens if the Defendant Claims Indigence and his Lawyers Ask to Withdraw?”

    I reread two articles. The judge will be very reluctant to let at least one of them leave the closer the trial date approaches. This is the relevant article.

    What I am not sure about, and I do not remember exactly or maybe never quite understood, to what extend the recently published expenses by defense would matter, I seem to remember from comments. Maybe since I am a skeptic concerning the scenario that O’Mara will quit.

    The context of these comments seemed to be: Law firm support and Infrastructure + Case related expenses. If I did not completely misunderstand.

    Case related matters cannot matter much, since they are usually paid even when the attorney works pro bono. I don’t know to what extend they may be considered too high expenditures and if there is any legal limit beyond which something could be defined as income. But would it really matter in the case of declaring indigence, if the lawyer was paid before? There could be cases in which someone spends all his assets and has to be declared indigent on the way. I would assume that a pro bono lawyer would be more likely to continue in spite of lower rates. For him that is better than before.

    What if the extras are defined as on loan from GZ to defense? And there exist internal contracts concerning this matter? Could the state ask Fogen/defense to sell these things and pay back state expenses with the money gained? If they declare it a present from Fogen to defense, then Fogen must pay gift taxes on it, since it looks above 15.000 $.

    The question is how the law firm infrastructure and manpower update would be handled in combination with the statement that there is no money for experts. Maybe that is why they talked about missing time instead. – BDLR made that connection too.

    I never quite understood Frederick’s comments concerning the hard and software updates and extras supporting the legal team in connection with indigence. But now I realize that it may well be an issue.

    I’ll shut up now, promised. 😉

  5. leander22 says:

    Ok, I reread two articles. The judge will be very reluctant to let at least one leave the closer the trial date approaches. This is the relevant article.

    What I am not sure about, and I do not remember exactly or maybe never quite understood, to what extend the recently published expenses by defense would matter. Especially concerning: Law firm support and Infrastructure + Case related expenses.

    Case related matters cannot matter much, since they are usually paid even when the attorney works pro bono. I don’t know to what extend they may be considered too high expenditures. We have no details how much was paid for the usual case related matters, and what is a little extra luxury. The question is how the law firm infrastructure and manpower update would be handled in combination with the statement that there is no money for experts. Although they did not quite put it that way. They talked about missing time.

    I never quite understood the comments concerning this larger matter.

  6. Jamie Foxx, Cedric the Entertainer to attend Trayvon Martin peace walk, family attorneys say


    An Academy Award-winning actor and a famed stand up comedian will attend a weekend event in Miami in remembrance of Trayvon Martin, a law firm representing the slain teen’s family has announced.

    The Tallahassee-based Parks & Crump firm announced that Jamie Foxx and Cedric the Entertainer will attend the “Day of Remembrance Community Peace Walk and Forum,” which is being hosted by foundation created by the teen’s parents.

    The event, which starts 10 a.m. Saturday at Ives Estate Park in Miami, will focus on “motivating youth on peaceful conflict resolutions instead of gun violence,” the firm said in a statement. The following evening, the foundation plans to hold a remembrance dinner at the DoubleTree Miami Airport Hotel’s convention center.

  7. You all have thoughtful comments says:

    @ this dance video:

    Published on Apr 9, 2012

    This is a video was done to remember our fallen brother Trayvon Martin who was murdered by a neighborhood watchman in Florida, as of yet Trayvon didn’t receive any justice for his murder, in Brooklyn we are all to familiar with people judging from appearance,and all types of stereotypical situations, we just want the family of Trayvon know we hear your cries and we are all hear with you on this FIGHT FOR JUSTICE so we did what we do to help support the cause ,and thats DANCE. D.R.E.A.M. Dance Rules Every Thing Around Me.!!!!

  8. whonoze says:


    Do you have a citation or link for the Florida law you mentioned that would potentially prohibit O’Mara or West from continuing as GZ’s attorneys if he declares indigence?

  9. leander22 says:

    Our host, the professor has written articles about that.

    Maybe they answer your question. The basic question is will the pro-GZ provide 30.000$ a month regularly, or not. O’Mara’s argument is they have to, otherwise he cannot handle the case effectively.

    I think I will need to go back myself and read it again. 😉 I belong to the camp here that somehow doubts MOM will/can drop Zimmerman and may still represent him if he declares him indigent too, which hasn’t happened yet. And I doubt it will. I think there are enough out there that feel GZ should be well fed and safe.

    • fauxmccoy says:

      leander – the professor explained just a few days ago that should fogen be declared indigent, then according to new laws, o’mara would be removed from the case and replaced with a public defender. it would be o’mara’s ‘get out of hell free’ card.

    • Lonnie Starr says:

      Well, he’s certainly being well fed!

      |||=> Tick Tock! <-|||

  10. SearchingMind says:

    (Possible) consequences of yersterday’s debackle for the defense

    a. There WON’T be any SYG-/self-defense immunity hearing for the reasons Professor mentioned and eloquently ruminated on in: “The Defense in the Trayvon Martin Case Should Waive the Immunity Hearing, Sunday, January 27, 2013”. But O’Mara will try to convince the world otherwise. Consider the following: O’Mara: “with sorrow and pain in our heart, we regret to announce that the defense has decided not to file any motion for SYG-/self-defense immunity hearing. The order denying continuance has made it impossible to provide Fogen a vigorous SYG-/self-defense immunity hearing within the very short period of time between now and 25th April 2013. Also the defense fund is almost empty making it almost impossible for Fogen to hire expert witnesses, cover the costs of investigations, depositions, etc. on the one hand and pay for his and his wife’s living expenses on the other hand. The defense has therefore decided to present a SYG-defense- or alternatively a traditional self-defense at the trial in June. The defense needs about $500.000 to $1million in order to be successful and secure an acquittal in June. If we don’t get that amount by May, Fogen may not get the vigorous defense he deserves. His indictment is politically motivated and now he is being railroaded by the system. No American deserves this. The defense is therefore appealing to those who believe in fair trial to step up and help Fogen financially and also contact their rich friends who they believe can solve this financial problem once and for all by just dropping $1million in the defense fund”.

    b. O’Mara will hang on to the case (how history remembers O’Mara is of paramount importance to him. I think the damage he will sustain if he abandons this case will be greater that the damage if he stays on);

    c. Unfolding events will force Fogens hands and have him declared indigent whether he likes it or not (because the money flowing into the defense fund will neither be enough to pay costs investigations, depositions, transcripts of depositions, etc. nor the living expenses of himself and his wife. This little Butcher will be forced to accept taxpayers’ money to stop the bleeding and limit the damage);

    d. D. West will leave the defense team before the trial (nothing in the case suggest that two defense counsels are necessary to provide Fogen with fair trial);

    e. Attorney Crump will NOT be deposed (his 15-page affidavit is detailed and comprehensive; his deposition will yield nothing new and Crump will assert attorney-client privilege after every question asked; the court has no appetite for any unnecessary constitutional fights regarding the scope of that privilege).

    • leander22 says:

      I am wrong, it is his rearrest. Even the WP? Hmm. In that case it makes the connection between his hiding funds that BDLR made. Maybe I am too pessimist again. Reading too much into matters. 😉


      Let’s see. I hope Nelson rules till the end of the week concerning Benjamin Crump. And I am highly curious about Team Fogen’s response too. It may come as a press release.

      Obviously, when Dee Dee made her statement she had heard GZ NEN call. We would have a much better scenario concerning her statements, had SPD done it’s job and interviewed her earlier. On the other hand, they had troubles to get at the phone due to the password. That’s the crux.

      One minor question if the records for 02/26/2013 were supportive of Trayvon would they have smiled? Assuming they learned to easily read the relevant parts based on what they already have for the date. OK, maybe it needs more work. BDLR: I can connect the dots for you.

      • roderick2012 says:

        leander22: Obviously, when Dee Dee made her statement she had heard GZ NEN call.

        You know this how?

        Or have you been playing with the monkeys over at the Treehouse again?

        DeeDee also made statements about things GZ stated that Witness #11 stated that she heard and that wasn’t recorded on George’s NEN call.

      • leander22 says:

        roderick, I had a nice chatter with the treehousers yesterday night and this afternoon. I enjoyed it a lot. Much more easy to face them now. The professor and Amsterdam helped me to get rid of my blocks concerning this camp and suddenly my mind works much better again. I have to admit, I fear this mindset and fear blocks.

        It’s pretty much towards the end, and I didn’t read most of the comments. I use the same aka as over here. I was surprised I wasn’t monitored or deleted and let into this rumor or “righteous Americans” circles. Religious too; “Prayer requests”.

        All, please forgive if I do not respond to responses always, I should check the notify my of follow-up option, But I am hesitant to check the first box below, since I use my main email address in connection to my Word Press account. I would first need to change it. Or alternatively create a filter in Thunderbird.

  11. Trained Observer says:

    Re-watched Tuesday’s hearing this morn and was double-struck by the Big Tell at the end: MOM and West curtly turning and departing without so much as a glance, much less an arm-pat or word for Fogen. There Trayvon’s killer was, left stranded with the blonde until the bailiff showed up. Contrast that with body language of the same players at the bond hearings.

    Yesterday must have been an eye-opener for Fogen, a guy who likes to be a star-hero and thinks it’s all about him.

    Consider how few references to any issue even used his name. Action mostly centered on a chummy little tango among attorneys and the judge about points of law and other aspects … who lives in Tallahassee … who operates in Jacksonville … who represents who and who has appeared in what court before who on other cases, some civil.

    It seemingly was all in code that suggested “we know this guy is cooked, so we’re only here to debate the finer points of the recipe so that we can all look like master chefs and get on with our careers and legal cases to come.

    Unlike the clumsy MOM and seemingly dense West, Blackwell charmed the judge talking about his representation of Ben Crump and Crump’s firm, while signaling a big fight ahead on potential depositions. BDLR held steady, and Nelson showed herself to be calm and lethal.

    But there was no surprise star-turn opp for Fogen.

    Can’t you just hear Fogen inwardly screaming: But what about ME? When are we going to talk about ME? And when is this going to go away like my daddy and pals all promised?

  12. leander22 says:

    I politely would like to disagree concerning Mom/West had nothing to say and will give up the case, they hammered in matters already discussed and decided on earlier. They did not need to do much concerning their power base. They triggered the association, how long are they trying to get at Benjamin Crump, Dee Dee, the parents. They needly hid the fact that they did not depose them already beneath the argument that they needed the Twitter and Facebook accounts first.

    I do not completely understand the argument, why they could not continue if court declares Fogen indigent. I understand that only one could stay, and be paid on a minimal basis. But strictly the other would only need to officially (I do not completely trust that) for free as he has done anyway. Remember he left his job to twiddle his thumbs from the defense perspective since he couldn’t get his hands on what he needed!

    Concerning expenses by O’Mara couldn’t it be argued that beyond the usual legal fees e.g. for file copies all the assets bought are technically/legally bought by Fogen and on loan to the defense team from him. Defense cannot deal with these items freely after the judgment.

    Back to had nothing to say. From our and quite possibly Nelson’s perspective. But from the Fogen support base too?

    Perusing news, seemingly quite a few legal expert expected the continuance or delay would be granted. Jeralyn too is back to her three years argument, with a little case law as evidence.

    The fogennuts on the tree argue that some type of case can be made concerning discovery violation and witness impeachment.

    O’Mara paraded a graphic outlay of evidence demanded and evidence received. Very careful to mention that the delays were marked in blue. Most seemed to be blue.

    True, defense herself canceled a hearing with Nelson, but they strictly argued that their earlier issue on which she already ruled, has not been resolved yet. Since they want access to DeeDee’s Twitter and Facebook accounts. Adding a plus for defense is that quite obviously prosecution forwarded incomplete evidence concerning the cell-phone records.

    Add to that Benjamin Crump’s reactions from the perspective of the Fogen-supporters, (I have no idea who recently he was deposed for the same day, maybe there is a trick involved from defense. The latest deposition up on their side on Jan. 23, 2013 does not concern Benjamin Crump.) So defense effectively could lean comfortably back on their chairs, since Crump’s late filed affidavit only for his deposition, filed on the day it was meant to happen, added Crump stalling to the stalling efforts by state. Did they only give him only a very short one. two, three day’s advance notice? We do not know. The statement by West that this has been debated suggests something else.

    A Jeralyn blog partner adds this:

    Is this a criminal law thing? (5.00 / 1) (#3)
    by Big Tent Democrat on Tue Feb 05, 2013 at 06:40:00 PM EST
    In a civil case, Crump would be deposed period.

    He can raise attorney-client privilege on a question by question basis.

    Or is this a Florida thing?

    Very weird.

    Keep in mind they “only” need 1.500 supporters willing to pay 20$ a moth, with some possibly giving more, since they can afford it. The larger political context concerning gun laws helps their case. Strictly they could do it for themselves to help George to make these attacks on their rights to own guns go away. Brother tries to mobilize that camp for longer now.

    • leander22 says:

      needly I have no idea how such stuff happens, this was meant to be “neatly”. If there is more, I won’t make this a whole series of corrections. But this caught my eye. Since the word sticked out on first sight, after I had posted the comment.

    • leander22 says:

      one afterthought. I just got myself a cup of coffee, and suddenly this surfaced on my mind. What if the expert software and having all the files in a database accessible was done for George too, he may even have suggested it. He can now study it easily at home without them having to deliver copies all the time. Much more handy. Besides from a security perspective much more advisable too. And as we know security is the top issue not only in the case itself, but also in the aftermath.

      Mr. Zimmerman has involved himself in the case

      Wonder if I should befriend him, I would like to see the deposition files not tiny bits of sound bits that defense lets out.

      Anonymous? I would love to be a whitehat now. 😉

    • roderick2012 says:

      @ leander22

      We must have watched two different hearings.

      O’Mara slipped and admitted that he isn’t prepared to go to trial because he’s been spending too much time trying this case in the media via the internet. One would think that one of his ‘six interns’ would take over posting documents on the website.

      Add to the fact that O’Mara is one of the lawyer’s named on George’s civil suit against NBC it could be argued that O’Mara has just mismanaged his time and that’s no reason for the judge to delay the trial.

      As for Crump’s deposition his lawyer was a bit melodramatic when he stated that Crump was acting as an officer of the State when he sought out DeeDee so he could question her.
      I still don’t understand the attempt to get DeeDee’s social media handle unless it’s just another way to delay the trial because we all know that Facebook and Twitter have already stated that they will fight any attempt by O’Mara to obtain any information about Trayvon’s social media.
      But West screwed the defense when he attempted to force Judge Nelson to make a decision from the bench on whether Crump could be deposed immediately.

      Either West has a hearing problem (it probably would help if spoke from the podium and not the defense table) or he is learning disabled, because he also wanted (as far as I could hear) to expand the scope of Crump’s deposition.

      Then there’s the crap about getting the chain of custody logs from the State for Trayvon’s cell phone. The State stated that the defense had been invited and actually accepted their invitation to go to Cellebrite and view the technicians work on Trayvon’s cell phone but they declined at the last minute. Again what kept O’Mara and West from going and if they were busy why didn’t O’Mara send one of his ‘six interns’ to go?
      To top it off these incompetents forgot to discuss the order to obtain Matt Gutman’s copy of DeeDee’s interview.

      • manberk says:

        Agree on all points. About the only thing they do discuss are the conspiracies, and they dont even seem to have a good grasp of those. Nelson has already expressed her trust in Crump as an officer of the court. The recording device and recording has passed thru the FDLE, FBI and was witnessed by a member of the media. Thats a lot to over come with rumors and accusation. Sure seems like a dead end to me. And DD? If they want her twitter handle they are admitting their earlier accusations about her based on tweets they presented to the court, we they wrong person. So there doesnt appear to be any real basis for looking at her social media other than some other girls actions in the days following the murder. Just another fishing expedition.

        “To top it off these incompetents forgot to discuss the order to obtain Matt Gutman’s copy of DeeDee’s interview.”

        I know right? Nor the “missing” gps data. I wonder if we should read into it?

      • fauxmccoy says:

        i can only add that o’mara admitted in open court that they also had no expert witnesses. otherwise, excellent summation.

        • Lonnie Starr says:

          300,000 dollars spent and not even an experts review of the all too important NeN tape, which shouldn’t have cost more than a couple of thousand dollars at best. 300,000 dollars spent and not an eight and a half by eleven double spaced page of exculpatory expert testimony obtained or generated. |||=> Tick Tock! <-|||

    • Eric says:

      I think those earlier issues that weren’t resolved was because the defense is dragging it’s feet. In BDLR’s motion he laid out the failings of MOM in regards to speaking with Crump and others. Mom waiving blue graphics around is about as relevant as his waiving of the color photo of Fogen. I don’t believe Crumps affidavit was filed “late”, it seems to me to be a shut the hell up and do your damned job response to the defense. If Crump filed his affidavit on time how is that stalling? Can you name these stalling tactics of the state? I think you should read Bernies motion.

      • roderick2012 says:

        Eric, I agree with you about defense dragging its feet.

        I don’t understand what O’Mara was talking about when he kept mentioning that he can’t depose Trayvon’s parents until he has some background information on them.

        If he wants to know something about them all he has to do is ask the Treehuggers because I am sure they have been going through Trayvon’s parents’ garbage since this story made headlines.

      • Xena says:


        I don’t believe Crumps affidavit was filed “late”, it seems to me to be a shut the hell up and do your damned job response to the defense.

        You’re correct — Attorney Blackwell said that he just received notification of the deposition the previous day.

        Something that those experienced in courts and the law may have noticed that also worked to Blackwell’s and Crump’s favor was that Crump was in the court room. He was not at his office in Tallahassee or somewhere else. He was sitting right there in the courtroom in the event that Judge Nelson ordered that the deposition be held.

        That shows respect for the court and not taking things for granted.

    • manberk says:

      @leander22 I dont by his graphical representation of delays and to me it was obvious the court didnt either. A huge % of the discovery was presented in May. The items hes complained about were most likely in blue. Like the recent new pic of TM that was available to the public since last March. And the color pic that was sent to him on CD, and that he was told to go to the FDLE and get himself. Or, info on the recording device, even though hes failed to follow the courts suggestion long ago to deposition those in question. Etc etc. They were in color graphics for one reason, to waive in front of the camera. IMO.

      • leander22 says:

        thanks, manberk, it’s odd to dive into the perception of the other other camp. Makes my mood drop. And mood changes perception. I was completely taken aback by their insults of Debra Nelson. I didn’t even realize the German housewife is used in the US. Is this a term only used by Americans with German roots? Additionally they attack her abilities. Racism and misogyny are an old couple.

        Obviously O’Mara hypes the importance of the twitter and Facebook accounts for this base. It was interesting that BDLR reminded him that he once claimed he already had them. They are looking for the entry that shows a completely unconcerned and cheerful DeeDee the day after. And it makes me angry to read arguments attending the wake or funeral. I denied to do that at DeeDee’s age. The first time I did, I completely broke down. At that point I understood what my earlier resistance may have been about. It’s something horribly final, you can suppress a lot better if you do not stand in front of a grave.

        Besides I have been worrying about DeeDee for quite a while, ask Malisha, sometimes it surfaces again. I hope she is protected by a lawyer that protects her against mean tricks. Although maybe BDLR can too? But that may be considered partiality. It’s so obvious they would like to get rid of her: Witness impeachment. As if there was nothing else.

        Ok, strictly their game is to make it appear as if they had to postpone depositions since they wanted to get at the social media data first. Is it really relevant? Even if they find something to hang their argument on?

        I am wondering if the four below refers to are BJ, TM, SF and DeeDee:

        11. As Defendant noted in his motion, the State on numerous occasions has arranged for witnesses to appear or transported them to depositions without Defendant having to find and serve the witnesses with subpoenas. On some if not most occasions, the State provided this assistence, even though Counsel waited to depose. This really didn’t provide ample time for the State’s investigatiors or give adequate notice to witnesses. Nevertheless, the State has been successful in making sure the vast majority of witnesses showed up at the scheduled time.

        12. And while many depositions have been taken, in some cases it was only after the State repeatedly asked that depositions be set. There have been too many delays in getting Defense Counsel to schedule depositions, on at least four occasions depositions were scheduled (entire days were set aside), only to be informed by Defense Counsel the depositions were canceled.

        The State has expressed its frustration with this process.

        • Lonnie Starr says:

          The social media accounts of DD are not probative, because she was not physically present in RATL when these events took place, she is only an “ear witness” to what would be hearsay if not for the exceptions to those rules.

          As such, I would not allow them to go after her social media material, because it’s only utility is as impeachment material. No amount of impeachment material, that is external to her statements about what she witnessed by ear, can have any fair application. If this witness is to be impeached in any way, shape or form, that impeachment must come from a demonstration that what she is testifying to is either not what occurred or could not have occurred.

          This is because, obviously, without having been present and without any knowledge of the paths, roads, houses, their locations and the distances between them, she could not possibly fashion false testimony that could fit the conditions that night, with any precision at all.

          MOM needs to climb back into his cave, he’s trying to cover up his own gross stupidity with even more wasteful gross stupidity.
          Even if he were to get his hands on her social media materials, and managed to find some kind of impeachment material in them, it would not be allowed in court, because it would not be either relevant or probative. In short, you cannot impeach an account that cannot be falsely fashioned.

      • leander22 says:

        I wanted to stop the posting and first correct the mistakes. But there you go. Thanks anyway.

      • fauxmccoy says:


    • Jun says:

      All I can say is, it should not take them this long, and all they have got going is trying to get a facebook and twitter?

      Those are her private accounts, if she actually has them, so IMO she does not have to give them up or even mention she has them or anything, as it is irrelevant

      They could have depo’d her and asked her in person or through telephone… which would have accomplished everything within a day…

      W8 could say yes or no or that she refuses to answer the question on grounds her privacy would be infringed in a homicide case by the defendant, and it has already been proven that it has already been attempted

      The defense should have their ducks in a row by now… they have 4 months, which is more than enough time to do things…

      at the same time, I dont blame Omara, because if I was representing Fogenhats, I’d just take his money too and find nonsense to go after because he refuses to plea when it is way too obvious what happened

      • Xena says:


        All I can say is, it should not take them this long, and all they have got going is trying to get a facebook and twitter?

        O’Mara has known about Witness 8 since he took the case. It was not until the treeslum conspirators started illegally doxing DeeDee, and GZ’s defense fund was low, that O’Mara took up that banner. BDLR interviewed Witness 8, and that interview is what is most likely to be entered into evidence at trial.

        O’Mara’s going beyond the scope of State discovery and then trying to depose attorney Crump beyond the scope of the court’s order, is all drama for the benefit of the treeslummers. It has served O’Mara a benefit of acquiring $40,000 of assets for his law firm.

    • Malisha says:

      I think both the delay AND the “vanishing money” argument are being made to try to give Fogen the backing he needs to escape. I also think O’Mara and West were happy to NOT get their continuance because they want to declare Fogen indigent but he does not want that because of the investigation into the money that would necessarily result.

    • SearchingMind says:

      “Is this a criminal law thing? (5.00 / 1) (#3) by Big Tent Democrat on Tue Feb 05, 2013 at 06:40:00 PM EST

      In a civil case, Crump would be deposed period.
      He can raise attorney-client privilege on a question by question basis.

      Or is this a Florida thing?

      Very weird”.

      IMO, ‘Big Tent Dem’s answer is convoluted and wrong: (a) the right to depose a witness is not universal in the US. Some States of the Union don’t have it (for criminal defendants); (b) the right to depose is not absolute. It can be overridden/limited by other superior rights and privileges; (c) Judge Nelson did NOT rule that Crump should not be deposed; (d) Judge Nelson postponed the deposition to study the affidavit provided by Mr. Crump. If the said affidavit provides answers to the question for which Crump was meant to be deposed, his deposition will become unnecessary and irrelevant; (e) a Judge can order that a witness not be deposed EVEN in a civil case, e.g. if it is manifest that the witness in question has absolutely nothing to offer; the plaintiff misuses the right to depose to unnecessarily delay proceedings, etc.

      Honestly I think those guys at talkleft many a time get detrimentally too presumptuous.

  13. You all have thoughtful comments says:

    The following is an exchange that occurred under a NBC newsvine article yesterday and continued this morning.

    I am quoting it now to alert you to what I feel is a brand new strategy being considered by the defense team.

    Here is the exchange:

    >Sam 627556——–

    I think it was an accident that he shot Trayvon but once he started lying he could not stop, its a shame but that is why telling the truth is so important, he can’t walk because a life was lost but he would not be in the hot seat he now finds himself.

    You all have thoughtful comments——-

    It was not an accident. George had wrist control of Trayvon and shot Trayvon in the heart.


    I remember “thoughtful” was one of the people who had Zimmerman emptying a fully-loaded gun into Martin (as opposed to the reality of the single shot.) I regard his claim that Zimmerman pursuing an innocent Martin for no reason to have about as much merit.




    [[ “I remember “thoughtful” was one of the people who had Zimmerman emptying a fully-loaded gun into Martin (as opposed to the reality of the single shot.)” ]]

    That’s BS, “thoughtful” has never made such a ridiculous claim, you are just spewing lies!

    You all have have thoughtful comments——

    Jo-An is correct.

    I NEVER wrote that. We all know that gz fired just ONE bullet.

    Jo-An, it is very curious that Pvblivs chose to make his comment RIGHT AFTER I had refuted Sam’s assertion that gz shooting Trayvon was an “ACCIDENT.”

    I think that the gz legal team NOW is trying to introduce this word “ACCIDENT” in the same manner as they tried to introduce the words “STREET FIGHT”

    Does the word “ACCIDENT” represent a NEW strategy by the defense team?

    • SearchingMind says:

      YAHTC, You are fighting good battles over there. Please be kind enough to let me know when your sword wears out. I shall kindly provide you with more.

    • groans says:

      In response to the killer-supporters’ “accident therory”:

      The killer himself stated that he aimed the gun, was careful to keep his other hand out of the line of fire, and then shot Trayvon.

      Not “accidental” in the least, according to the killer’s own account!
      I wish I could remember which group of the killer’s lies contains that gem, but I bet blushedbrown could tell you in a hurry!

      (Good idea to reference the location of that statement – because even if the crazies refuse “to live evidence-based lives,” other reasonable people reading there might be interested in seeing it for themselves.)

    • cielo62 says:

      YAHTC~ Very interesting! I’d say they could TRY to couple that with the “original” Manslaughter charge that Serino published, before having it squashed. They might try to twist the whole mess inot an “accidental shooting”

      except that GZ has stated that he didn’t regreat ANY of it, so I guess the “accident” was not really an accident. Anyway, it might be being thrown out there to appease the nuthouse advisers. Something new for them to donate over and howl about.

  14. Rachael says:

    I wish I knew how to do a blog. Every day I am sickened by that racist outhouse that posts article after article of crimes committed by black male youth, always managing to liken them to Trayven, as if ALL black male youth are criminals and there are no white male youths committing horrendous acts.

    I would dedicate my blog to blck youth, male and female, who are achieving and making a difference in this world and maybe white people who committ bad acts (there are enough of them where I live for sure), but I’d maybe rather keep ugly violence off of it, but still, just to show them it isn’t isolated to blacks or black youth.

    God I hate that racist outhouse!!!

    • Jun says:

      Even though it is racist, they are idiots

      the simple fact is every race of person has committed crimes

      a vast majority of pedophiles and serial killers are white males, but does that mean all white males are pedos and serial killers?

      Of course it does not

      I would not even worry

      What are their videos proving except of other black people committing crimes, people that are not Trayvon…

      while we have proof that they have committed witness intimidation and cyberstalking which equals crimes LOL

    • MichelleO says:

      The wonderful thing about the Internet is that you see this type of talk in real time. No more hiding the truth about the racism that is alive and well in America.

    • Xena says:


      Every day I am sickened by that racist outhouse that posts article after article of crimes committed by black male youth, always managing to liken them to Trayven, as if ALL black male youth are criminals and there are no white male youths committing horrendous acts.

      Look at it this way — That blog supports their belief that GZ committed a racial hate crime. The Zimmermans have aligned themselves with that blog. The Zimmermans only say “We’re not racist” while thanking bigoted racists for their support, while they use dog whistles such as the word “savage” implied to Trayvon.

      And — the federal investigation into GZ’s violations of Trayvon’s civil rights is ongoing.

      • Rachael says:

        I would feel better if I knew for a fact that a federal investigation was going on – because there has been plenty of food for fodder lately.

        • The feds love secrecy and usually are not in any hurry to wrap-up an investigation. They like to make sure they have a slam dunk before they swoop in, arrest people and hold a press conference to announce the indictment and identify the defendants.

          I suspect the investigation remains open and active, but no decision has been made to charge anyone pending the outcome of the defendant’s case.

          • racerrodig says:

            “I suspect the investigation remains open and active, but no decision has been made to charge anyone pending the outcome of the defendant’s case.”

            I can tell you for a fact the investigation is open and the Feds as you say want a slam dunk. I know for fact (was told outright) they don’t want this to be a “…lets all pick on Cheorge…” thing. That would get him sympathy……especially if SheLie turns up preggos.

            The Sanford Police, The State of FL, The FBI, The County of Seminole and any other agency all leaning on poor old Cheorge and he’s just a victim of a savage beating…..can’t have that now can we.

            If you read the gzlegalcase website it goes down that road. Poor old Fogen has no means to fight the State who has “…unlimited resources….” with which to persecute poor ole’ Fogen.

            Damn, I just hate when that happens.

        • Xena says:


          I would feel better if I knew for a fact that a federal investigation was going on – because there has been plenty of food for fodder lately.

          BDLR said it in court. If you sent a request to DOJ, they will reply that there is an ongoing investigation. As well, I received info from a very credible source that there is an ongoing investigation.

          One thing about the feds is that they take their time collecting all info and evidence possible before taking it before the federal grand jury. Seldom do they charge with one count — it’s numerous counts.

      • Rachael says:

        Thank you both. That makes my day 🙂

  15. Looolooo says:

    I sure hope that someone will post the hearing on youtube, here or somewhere. I was only able to catch muted snippets on my iphone, and am desperate to view the entire hearing after reading ALL of the comments and reviews here.

    Xena, Malisha, yahtc, racerrodig, lonnie, Trent……anybody!!!

    • Two sides to a story says:

      There are several links to it upthread. You can find it on YouTube at stateoftheinternet. You can also go over to the Conservative Treehouse if you dare and catch a link there.

      • cielo62 says:

        Two Sides~ I’m lazy. I’m waiting for the compilation/”Best of” highlights video to be produced!  🙂  I want to see the main points and the GZ shedding a few tears at the realization of his fate.

        • They already did a Casey Anthony movie…..I would who will star in the fogen movie after the trial and conviction?.

          Where does one find a 3 faced, 3 chinned actor the size of Fat Bastard?

          Tom Hanks did well as Forest Gump…….It will take one hell of an actor to creditably portray fogens stupidity.

          • fauxmccoy says:

            kathy bates in drag? best i can come up with – although i do think she’s a fabulous actress, she’d still need some extra padding to pull this one off. however, since fogen is now sporting a nice set o’man bewbs it just might work.

            danny devito in lifts might work too.

          • From the looks of things…..he’s up to a “C” cup now…. 😐

          • fauxmccoy says:

            how often do you think he needs to buy bigger kevlar vests? i guess shellie can get his hand me downs.

            uggg…… full body shivvers, dude! he’s gonna be like scarlett o’hara saying ‘tighter, miss shellie, tighter’ to reign himself in.

          • racerrodig says:

            That was all Fogen kids. He did not look to be wearing a vset. A vest leaves an outline in the shirt and it was not there.

          • He IS wearing body armor ……6 inches of lard…….

          • racerrodig says:

            Well……….um, that is…..er, since you…..ok…..well, if you put it that way….I’ll buy that.

          • fauxmccoy says:

            that was my exact thought as well, racer – he has outgrown his security blankie. i saw no signs of it under his shirt, as i have always seen in the past. it was indeed a ‘full frontal fogen’ 😛

            (must scrub my mind now.)

          • racerrodig says:

            I’m very good at guessing weight. He’s definitely at about 3 bills. He’s 5 – 7 and I’m 5 – 9 185 and a little pot bellied, but look at his thighs…….yeeeessshhhhh ! I’m telling my wife I’m in as good a shape as Arnie…..compared to FogenPhoole anyway.

          • kindheart101 says:


            Good morning! I just logged on to catch up, and I am rolling! The conversation between you and MMP is hilarious!

          • This has ABSOLUTELY nothing to do with a case…..I was just e-mailed it by a friend…..GREAT for a morning laugh…….2 Dogs dining… 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂


          • fauxmccoy says:


            we could call it ‘george n shellie’ at the diner, but they display far more class.

          • fauxmccoy says:

            thank ye kindly, sweetheart – it has given me some fun on this sleepness night, have been most glad for his company 🙂

          • kindheart101 says:

            I won’t be here for long, but I wanted to say hello. My friend is driving up later today, and then we are heading up to my other friends cabin in the mountains. Like I told you, I haven’t been there in a few years, so I am really looking forward to it. I’ve been baking all morning, everything from bread to hearty stew, cookies and pies.

            We are going to catch up, enjoy nature, and eat well!

          • fauxmccoy says:

            sounds beautiful! enjoy my friend!

          • racerrodig says:

            I can see the Marquee posters now …….

            COMING to a THEATER near YOU !!

            A crime drama so BIZARRE it was years in the making

            A teen……just walking home

            A Family who loved and cared ……………….torn apart, yet stood
            with class & dignity !!

            A nation of supporters who stood behind them !!

            A crime so despicable ………………..his name can’t be mentioned !!


            John Travolta as Fogen……………a hatable killer
            Kathy Bates as SheLie……………who will lie to the court
            Denzel Washington as Benjamin Crump…. Out for Justice
            Willem DaFoe as…………. Moron O’ Mara
            Bruce Willis as…………………..Don West
            Jack Nicholson as…………Bernie de LaRionda
            Robert Duvall as………….Frank “The Racist Tank Taaffe”
            Anthony Hopkins as…………….Mark Osterman
            Meryl Streep as …………………Judge Nelson
            Cuba Gooding Jr. as…………..Tracy Martin
            Gabrielle Union as……………..Sabrina Fulton

            Follow a cast that brings this dramatic Tragedy to the big screen !!

            Watch as an innocent victim is stalked and murdered

            Watch as the killers lies crumble around him and swallow him up

            Watch as the Lawyers for the killer make mistake after critical

            Watch as the killer morphs from an arrogant smug self centered man to a whale of a self centered shell.

            Yes !! Justice was served and the name Trayvon Martin now stands for Justice and an end to racist hatred !!

            Everyone is free to name their favorite or more appropriate actor / actress. I was torn between Oprah and Union for Sabrina. Oprah is so accomplished but Gabrielle Union is younger and could play the part.

          • Agreed to the cast with the exception.

            I would have William Defoe as MOM replaced by Jim Carrey

          • jm says:

            MMP: “I would have William Defoe as MOM replaced by Jim Carrey.”

            Perfect casting with Jim Carrey. I might have Rosie O’Donnell play ShelLIE and Christopher Walken play West. What about Jack Black as GZ?

          • I would have chosen the Pillsbury Dough Boy cast as fogen…….

          • jm says:

            I understand Pillsbury Dough Boy doesn’t want to be typecast as a killer – bad for business.

          • The Sta Puff Marshmallow man was the villain in Ghostbusters……there could be a chance ?

          • jm says:

            @ MMP LOL – The Sta Puff Marshmallow man probably would be agreeable as long as GZ isn’t allowed on the set. Rumor has it GZ is fond of marshmallows and this could endanger Sta Puff’s life.

          • fauxmccoy says:

            michelin man as an understudy it is then!

          • blushedbrown says:


            You are too funny!

          • fauxmccoy says:

            @blushed — having a good crew to work with makes it easy:)

          • blushedbrown says:



          • jm says:

            Love this board. Lots of funny and clever people entertain me and inform me.

          • racerrodig says:

            Like I’ve said before….Team Trayvon….Home of the Good Guys !!

          • The Michelin Man could end up making it a foreign film, being as he’s European.

          • racerrodig says:

            Late last year the MM posted he hates FogePhoole so I don’t think he’ll agree to any of that………just sayin’

            Or was that MMP……..no matter, he’s hated !!

          • racerrodig says:

            That would be ok if it was animated. I hope the parent co. of Skittles, Wrigley, sues Fogen for something…..anything.

          • racerrodig says:

            DaFoe looks like O’ Mara and always plays a great bad guy (To Live & Die in LA) but I’ll go Carrey as long as he plays it straight…..no actual comedy.

          • blushedbrown says:


            the part of “Frank “was made for Nick Nolte

          • fauxmccoy says:

            or mel gibson on a bender … food for thought.

          • blushedbrown says:


            Good thought. Mel Gibson has been a bad boy.
            But I will stick with my Nick. HA!!


          • fauxmccoy says:

            oh, i can see that just as easily blushed, i just thought the racist rant dialog would be a natural for gibson, ya know?

          • blushedbrown says:

            you are so right!

          • racerrodig says:

            Hollywood magic……then again.

          • LMAO @ Blushed…..especially after some of Noltes DUI mugshots 🙂

          • blushedbrown says:


            HA! 😆

          • racerrodig says:

            Come to think of it, he did have a Taaffe goatee in one set.

          • racerrodig says:

            I love Nick Nolte. Maybe Tommy Lee Jones (who once held my son in a restaurant)

          • blushedbrown says:


            Love him.
            What about Billy Bob Thorton!

            I hope you have that picture of him holding your son!

          • racerrodig says:

            I didn’t have a camera. He was doing a movie in with some scenes being filmed in Atlantic City and in pulls a Limo and out comes TLJ and his group…dressed just like an average Joe. I had my son who was about 9 ? months old and was the cutest little thing (they all are). TLJ was right behind us in a fast food restaurant line and he said “…man what a handsome littledevil” and put his hands out to hold him. So TLJ held him for about a minute while I just sucked it all up.

            I didn’t have a cell phone with a camera.

          • blushedbrown says:


            aww, but that’s ok you have a picture in your head, that’s good enough.

          • racerrodig says:

            I will never, ever forget that. He was just so nice and well…..nice!!
            You would not believe what restaurant this was either…..you get 3 free guesses.

          • blushedbrown says:

            oh man that’s tough. Can I get some hints?

          • racerrodig says:

            There was a hint in a post within the last half hour.

            Hmmmmmmmmm Tough without giving it away.

            You wait in a line

            Several actors and actresses have done commercials for them as kids

            There have been many commercial ads with phrases that became part of our vernacular.

          • Mickie D’s?

            I met Ben Stein at the Mickie D’s at the Denver Airport a few years back..got a pic of us…neither of us dress for success 🙂

          • racerrodig says:

            Yep……….Mickey D’s in Mays Landing of all places. Some years ago John Force the all time wining-est drag racer of all time, allowed my to use a picture of he and I with him holding a sign with my company name on it. I have tri fold brochures that say “If World Champion John Force Ran Carburetors In His 7000 HP Funny Car He Would Choose XXX”

            At the top is a picture of Force, big smile holding that sign.

            It’s nice to have gotten around in this great big world. Then there is that weekend I had at Atco with Bob Glidden…..that’s a long story !

          • racerrodig says:

            Oppps I forgot. Ben Stein is a funny guy just with that dead pan delivery. I love when us regular folk get to have a small link with those big names….

          • Lonnie Starr says:

            Don’t kid yourself, it isn’t easy acting like a potted palm for 2 hours.
            |||=> Tick Tock! <-|||

    • Trent has it at his site, State of the Internet.

    • Lonnie Starr says:

      Here ya go: http://tinyurl.com/arwwe8g all five parts courtesy of State of the Internet, Trent Sawyer.

      • Mary Davis says:

        Poor Fogen. His lawyers didn’t even sit by him. Just ignored him. Even his baby sister sat far away from him. What is really going on here.

        • Lonnie Starr says:

          What’s going on is, over time they’ve all been hearing about things being said on the internet, they’ve finally had a chance to look and read. At first they were probably restricted by loyalty to keeping to proZ sites. But, as curiosity would have it, they get to peek at the NoZ sites and do they ever get an eyeful.

          That is because, while the Pro Z sites are full of emotion and twisted assertions. The No Z sites are filled with quotes of evidence, links to evidence, timelines, calculations and plausible theories derived from or based upon the understandings we have. There’s not much in the way of denigrating GZ, except for what he did and how he has tried to cover it up.

          By now they have to realize just how terribly foolish it was to squander 300k when experts were needed to study the evidence, if they were to have any hope of winning. Worse, they cannot deny that GZ’s credibility has taken irrecoverable hits, such that if he tried to tell his story to a jury himself, the SP will have the material it needs to slam him down hard.

          Even his main point of self defense or SYG fail, because there’s no dna or trace on Trayvon’s hands. Hand that had to have touched GZ, if his claims are to appear to have the least chance of being true. Thus, the family must now feel, even though they don’t want to say it, that GZ actually slaughtered an innocent child. Not wanting to appear disloyal to the family, they won’t come out and say anything in public, but, I’m afraid the message has seeped in and they can’t shake it out. So all they can do is distance themselves from GZ.

          GZ has seen this coming as his own conflicting stories have been puzzling them for some time. Like Hannity, they go somewhere and make assertions, based on what GZ told them, only to have GZ repudiate it later. They are devastated. Now GZ is lonely, he has finally alienated everyone even his own defense team.

          He doesn’t like how he’s being treated, but he doesn’t think that has anything to do with the way the evidence has stacked up against him, or the way he’s continued to sprout newer conflicting stories to patch up and cover over the discoveries they’ve made.

          So, Justice for Trayvon is coming |||=> Tick Tock! <-|||

          • racerrodig says:

            Very well said ….I think it’s just about over but the clapping.

            |||=> Tick Tock! Tick Tock! Tick Tock! Tick Tock! Tick Tock! Tick Tock! Tick Tock! Tick Tock! Tick Tock! Tick Tock! Tick Tock! Tick Tock! Tick Tock! Tick Tock! Tick Tock! Tick Tock! Tick Tock! Tick Tock! Tick Tock! Tick Tock! Tick Tock! Tick Tock! Tick Tock! Tick Tock! Tick Tock! Tick Tock! <-|||

          • Lonnie Starr says:

            I think MOM and West were smiling because they don’t take their work home with them at night. When it’s over it’s over, they walk from the court with clear minds already tuned to their social lives.
            Notice how none of the cheer was shared with GZ?

            Then MOM complains that he has no experts. What does he think? That experts just come running whenever they’re needed? Experts have to be located, hired and paid. If he has no experts that’s his problem, because he had 300k to hire all the experts he needed, instead he ran around crying and moaning for sympathy, using the 300k to put on a show. Now that it’s gone and the case lingers on, he’s got to do whatever he can to keep the family from questioning the advice he supplied.

            MOM had better hope he can find those three 711 boys they may be his only hope.

            Justice for Trayvon is Coming: |||=> Tick Tock! <-|||

          • jm says:

            What will the 7-11 boys prove Lonnie?

            I must have missed part of the theory. You think think someone lured Trayvon to want go out? Who and why?

            Sorry if I am misinterpreting the theory. I am trying to catch up and kind of speed-reading through posts.

          • Lonnie Starr says:

            MOM is after them, he noted that one of them used a credit or debit card to pay for a purchase. I reviewed a tape of them in the store and I noted that they appeared to be attempting to cover their faces. But there are two blacks and one white guy, so it could be Ranisburg and his two friends sans Burgess. I kinda think they’re GZ’s spotters, showing up at the store so soon after TM arrives.

            When I broached the idea that TM may have been lured from the house, someone came back with the idea that Chad had asked Trayvon to go to the store and get him some skittles. Blushedbrown found the tape and sure enough Chad says that Trayvon said he was going to the store, and he asked Chad if he wanted anything. Chad responded he wanted skittles.

            They also say that Trayvon may have wanted to talk privately with DD, but that doesn’t fly, he’s been speaking to her all day and now, both his father and Ms Green have gone out to dinner, so he could talk all he wanted without having to leave the house for that. As far as wanting some air or exercise, he’s had all day to go out. Why, suddenly leave for a trip to the store in the dark rainy night? For what? An iced tea? I’m sure the house was just loaded with snacks, he hasn’t had to go to the store for 6 days.

            These boys who meet him at the story have a car, yet no offer to drive him back? It’s raining out there. In fact, while it appears they brought an extra blunt, none was found on Trayvon, so they didn’t give it to him. They leave the store in an excellent position to follow Trayvon and mark his progress, as well as to get ahead of him and report his arrival. That Trayvon didn’t know he was being followed by them, only means that they were doing a better job that GZ did. After all, they would have known where TM lived, so they wouldn’t have to stay all that close.

            Well, let O’Mara get a hold of those guys, he’s got a big surprise coming, if I don’t miss my guess.

            Justice for Trayvon is Coming: |||=> Tick Tock! <-|||

          • racerrodig says:

            Like I said, I think it’s just about over for all intents and purposes.

            I do expert witness reports and testify in Consumer Fraud Auto civil cases. I know what it takes and how it works. I posted a comical expert script last night about what a typical Fogen expert would sound like.

            What are they going to find an expert on. Someone to challenge the DNA ?? That would have had to be done last year. The gun ?
            Fogen said he AIMED, and fired on shot, so an inadvertent discharge is out. That would have been his best bet in my opinion, but FogenPhoole had to brag about being the hero.

            Are they going to find someone to say the 2 pictures at the scene that show that savage beating ARE real….someone would have to have an expert report that says they are NOT first and I think the prosecution won’t go that way.


          • Lonnie Starr says:

            MOM fails to realize that, GZ can have all the injuries he wants, they don’t prove a thing unless he can prove that Trayvon is responsible for them. A task made incredibly difficult because, the evidence shows that TM did not use his hands. So, what MOM needs is a martial arts expert who is willing to claim that Trayvon did all that damage with his feet. Unfortunately that’s not likely to work because GZ’s big mouth has already been filled with his own feet.
            |||=> Tick Tock! <-|||

          • racerrodig says:

            Let me say first I forgot my III=> Tick – Tocks <=III since yesterday.
            My bad.

            Picture this in court.

            O' Mara "…..Ladies and Gentleman of the jury, we couldn't afford any expert witnesses other than my wife but she did find this video as proof that "Black Dynamite" er, Mr. Martin did inflict serious injury to my client without getting any DNA on this poor innocent man. Oh and she stayed in a Holiday Inn last night."

            "You'll see exactly how this happened…..after all……if I say it's undisputed, that should be good enough"

  16. Looolooo says:

    RZJ is soooo obviously racist! Good grief. Just finished watching him on Piers Morgan where he (yet again) just had to mention how more balaack journalists (Toure’, Charles Blow, and Johnathan Capehart…..this time) continue to lie about Fogen attacking Trayvon, and spreading their racist agenda against his (as Aunt Esther would call him) “fish-eyed fool” brother. I don’t think Iv’e ever heard him mention even one non balaack person who believes that Fogen is guilty, though they are many. Such as the non balaack people who are usually sitting next to and across from Toure’, Charles Blow, and Johnathan Capehart.

    He needs to give it a rest. Especially since it hasn’t helped rake in the $$$$$$ from his bro’s racist fan base. And Where’s RZJ’s website? How is he paying the bills? And since he loves his cro-magnon skulled brother so much, why not allow he and shelLIE bunk with him. Surely as a confirmed bachelor, he has the room.

    I hear impromptu car washes bring in major coin…….literally.

  17. Was it just me seeing things today, or did anyone else notice- Was Judge Nelson kind of annoyed-looking when the whole subject of the digital versus non-color versus color photo of the blood thing came up?

    • Rachael says:

      Hard to tell, she looked annoyed so much anyway.

    • Jun says:

      Perhaps Team Fogenhats is acting under Fogenhats’ orders, hence their repeated nonsense and BS that do not mean much to anyone who can see through it, which is about 99% of society

      I do not see how the black and white vs the color would cause any sufficient delay to proceedings or preparation, among their other nonsensical complaints which they felt needed repeated rehashing, which is why I believe they are acting under Fogenhats’ orders because the Fogenhat KKKlan MO is to not bother properly addressing problems, act high siddity to others as if their shh dont stink, and just repeating lies and BS, as if it was the first time anyone has heard them

      At least Omara and West have stopped the head bash lies, but it has not stopped Junior to repeat these lies, and his excuse is, that we were not there and we should stick to facts, when he was not there and I do not see him sticking to any facts LOL

      Anyways I learned new Fogenhats code words

      Facts means lies and BS that should be taken as truth, or else the KKKlan will stand their ground against you LOL

      Undeniable means it is not true to normal people

    • roderick2012 says:

      @Crane Station

      Judge Nelson was definitely annoyed and she was specifically PO’ed at West who seems to have either a hearing problem( maybe he should address the bench from the podium and not the defense table) or a learning disability.

      If I heard correctly West wanted Judge Nelson to make a decision on the spot about whether Crump could be deposed immediately and she told him that she needed to read what Blackwell had submitted before she could make any decision and I also thought that West wanted to change the scope of Crump’s deposition and she wasn’t pleased with that new development.

      And O’Mara’s whining about not being able to find expert witnesses was classic.

      He agreed to the June trial date back in October and it’s his fault if he has not found any expert witnesses to address the ballistics and forensic evidence that the State provided to him months ago.

  18. ay2z says:

    You all have thoughtful comments shared this, thank you. What a beautiful message and tribute,

    Now click onto Xena’s page and read and listen:


    • You all have thoughtful comments says:

      Yes, ay2z,We are fortunate that Xena provided that page for us. 🙂

      • Xena says:


        Yes, ay2z,We are fortunate that Xena provided that page for us. 🙂

        I’m grateful to Kindheart101 for writing such a heart-felt poem — felt it deserved more than simply typed words on pages. Trayvon deserves a memorialized 18th birthday. The Youtube video currently has 93 views. That doesn’t include page views on the blog.

        As well, I thank everyone who posted comments. Trayvon touched our hearts, and Sybrina and Tracy are people of dignity who I lift up at every opportunity.

        • kindheart101 says:


          If I may take one moment to turn the tables, please?

          I see you give credit to many, on a regular basis. You are a very humble, giving lady.

          In truth, it was you that put the whole video together. It was your idea. You formatted it. You picked out the beautiful soundtrack. You selected Trayvon’s picture……….and it was you that had it uploaded to U Tube. (By way of Auntie, thank you)

          You have a heartfelt, warm, honest, caring site.

          Thank you Xena.

  19. ay2z says:

    This did not link right– and it’s a TERRIBLE choice, can it be deleted please. David Qualey has a particularly nice version of Jesu Joy and it worked from the posted link for me, same site..

    It must be an auto playlist that won’t stay at one video. 😦

  20. You all have thoughtful comments says:

    Does he ever know how to play that guitar!

    • ay2z says:

      I’m so sorry the right one didn’t link, click through to that youtube page and chose the right one– his own arrangement, good for late night here on this day.

      • jm says:

        YAHTC: “I still cannot forget gz empty apology to Trayvon’s parents.”

        The apology in court where he confronted Trayvon’s parents was offensive and self-serving with contradictory statements (lies). That is another reason why GZ remains despicable to me.

        • Jun says:

          It was not really an apology to be honest

          I say that to people, as well as many others, if someone loses a loved one

          “I am sorry for the loss of your loved one” (this is a condolence)

          An apology is admitting the wrong you did to someone and asking for forgiveness and showing regret…

          Fogenhats showed none of those above qualities… what he did was try and show condolences and then lie and manipulate again… so it is not even a condolence

  21. ay2z says:

    I’ve been reviewing some of LLMPapa’s videos, and came across this one. I hope he doesn’t mind.

  22. You all have thoughtful comments says:

  23. In my ShannoninMiami voice…..Hey kids!

    The New York Times picked up my tweet celebrating Trayvon’s birthday. Scroll down to the last one. Woot!

    Trayvon Martin’s Birthday Remembered Online


  24. Ty Flair says:

    Happy Birthday Trayvon Martin aka Slim, as a father I never felt this way about any one I never meet. I guess I see my son in you. I did not want this day to come, I knew it would be hard on your family. I am not a church going man,but I pray alot for your family. So when my time is up here on earth, I will be happy to meet you. Rest In Peace Trayvon Martin aka Slim.

  25. Mike says:

    If anyone was watching RZJR on Piers Morgan tonight, it was lol worthy.

  26. You all have thoughtful comments says:

    Listen to the quality of jokes sz will be able to entertain gz with:


  27. kindheart101 says:

    I’m exhausted, been up since 4:00 AM……I’m calling it quits for the night. Slow down people………LOL……….I had over 250 posts to read this morning just to try to catch up……ackkkkkkk.

    ((Hugs to all)) Be well, see you tomorrow.

    It was a wonderful day for you Trayvon. Justice is close. RIP

    • You all have thoughtful comments says:

      Love you, kindheart. Be blessed.

      • kindheart101 says:

        Good morning my friend.

        Wow, the posts were awesome in here last night! I have been reading all of them, in between trying to clean my kitchen. (I dropped a full container of grapefruit juice, which hit areas I didn’t even know existed! LOL)

  28. manberk says:

    He certainly had a tight part in his hair for his new role.
    The color charts showing all the delays in getting evidence released in April was masterful. LOL. JN’s faces and reactions were priceless.

  29. ay2z says:

    Does anyone know if the defense client arrived for cameras via the front steps of the courthouse again this time? OR did he pay attention to BDLR’s suggestion that he could prevent the focus on himself by not doing so.

    Trayvon Benjamin Martin’s tribute on the anniversary of his last birthday, would have greeted him instead.

    • Two sides to a story says:

      I didn’t see any news cameras following him around like before, but then, I may have missed it.

      • ay2z says:

        Thanks, he probably had his security wisk him in a back door well before cameras got there.

        Were you in court today?

      • racerrodig says:

        Well, it went something like this.

        Producer “….make sure you get Fogen as he gets out of the car. If Osterman is with him carrying his stuff, get that too”

        Camera #1 Operator “No problem, just look at the monitor and let me know if I miss anything”

        Camera #2 Operator. “10-4, I have the other side covered.”

        Reporter “OK guys, here they come……I don’t see Osterman or SheLie”

        Camera #1 Operator “SHIT, he’s the size of a house!!”

        Camera #2 Operator “Next time when I say bring the wide angle lenses, please don’t whine and say why”

        Camera #1 Operator “SHIT, he’s the size of a house!!”

        Reporter “Okay guys….we’re outa here”

      • Two sides to a story says:

        ay2z, no I watched online from far away.

  30. Jun says:

    the thing I dont get is why Omara and West repeat the same motions with essentially the same points all the time?

    I am starting to feel Fogenhats is involved in the motion writing because I am doubting anyone that went to law school could be that ignorant

    • ay2z says:

      Fillibuster attempt, comes to mind, how many times did Judge Nelson set them straight only to have them contradict, interrupt to continue their requests.

  31. You all have thoughtful comments says:

    What a day!

  32. Xena says:

    LLMPapa brings it to GZ — on a train. 🙂

    • ay2z says:

      L) YES!!! and I love the Benjamin Crump quote at the end.

    • Malisha says:

      Xena, I can’t SEE anything from the LLMPapa thing — there’s just blank white space. How do I find it on YouTube?

      • towerflower says:

        Malisha, this is the youtube link to this video:

        If that doesn’t work just type in LLMPapa into the search and you should find his site/videos. Hope that helped.

    • Malisha says:

      Had Fogen waited FIVE MINUTES before shooting Trayvon Martin, this problem would have never arisen. FOGEN is the person who decided that Trayvon Martin’s time was up. Now, this is coming back, probably karmically (is that a word?) to haunt him. BOOOOOOO!

  33. crazy1946 says:

    Actually after watching Fogon after the end of the hearing, I think today is the day it finally dawned on him just how much trouble he is in! I would guess in his mind he now only has two choices, one is to end it all and die as a martyr and the other is to run like a rabbit! He has a hard choice to make… As for MOM, I think he is actually attempting to provoke Fogon into firing him. That gets him off the hook gracefully, and allows him to look like a victim of Fogon’s personality….

  34. LLMPapa says:

    “The Spirit of Trayvon was in the courtroom today.” ~Attorney Benjamin Crump

    • Rachael says:


    • jm says:

      Karma in no uncertain terms racing towards GZ.

      • Without a doubt…

        I wonder if he’s now praying to the same “god” that planned for him to murder Trayvon, to save his porked out a$$ from prison….

        Maybe he can sue “god” along with NBC & ABC?


      • Malisha says:

        A friend of mine (best appellate lawyer I ever met/worked for/heard of) was clerking for a federal judge in Kentucky (or was it Tennessee?) when a vexatious litigator who was a paranoid sued the Devil for doing wrong on the earth and for personally tempting the plaintiff. The judge, a wise judge, told my friend to treat the case as very serious, and to write an opinion addressing every single point the paranoid made in his papers, and not to be dismissive or mocking. Then he revised the opinion and issued it. He agreed to all the facts that the plaintiff alleged, and agreed that the Devil did in fact deserve to be held accountable for all the torts he had perpetrated, and even those in particular he had perpetrated against the plaintiff. But then he said he had no jurisdiction to rule because the Devil was protected by the kind of absolute immunity we give to ambassadors and members of other countries’ embassies. He pointed out that the Devil was a “Foreign Prince” and was also the “Prince of Hades.” He quoted religious documents and Daniel Webster.

        This litigant was very satisfied, and stopped suing. He understood the decision and he thanked the judge. It was an amazing case!

        We all know that Robert Junior wants to make sure that Fogen sues EVERYBODY who has anything to do with this gross injustice being done to his decent-American brother, right? Perhaps he should be the one to sue God.

      • Two sides to a story says:

        Yes, Malisha, I absolutely think Fogen should pursue litigation with the Higher Power! Perhaps he too will accept his fate.

        • Lonnie Starr says:

          OMG what a horror, you see him leaving the court room? He looks like the Hindenburg moving towards the door. He’s gonna make some impression on the jurors when that witness says it was the bigger guy on top.

          I also think that “white tee shirt” is GZ, his multiple segmented rainwear jacket, simply catching the low light and reflecting a sheen as plastic is known to do. With black side strips from wrist to elbow, that jacket is designed to confuse observers. I wouldn’t be a bit surprised if MO didn’t pick it out for him.

          Here, go to part five and watch past Trents clicking around, till you see GZ get up to leave the court room. What a blimp he’s become. http://tinyurl.com/arwwe8g I guess he’s begun to stress.

          • racerrodig says:

            West slaps him on the shoulder and says “….buck up Fogen, it’ll probably be 35 years…………it’ll go fast, just lay off the Cherry Pop Tarts and Root Beer Barrels” (laughing hysterically to himself)

          • Lonnie Starr says:

            What could they be feeding him? The human body can’t gain more than 6 ounces per day, he’s gained over 1600 ounces, meaning he had to start gaining some time around when Nelson set the million dollar bail. I mean he’s been at it for under 300 days.

            Now he looks like a beach ball, as wide as he is tall. Well the 15,000 will probably last them till trial. |||=> Tick Tock! <-|||

          • racerrodig says:

            I make a Motion (are ya listening FogenPhoole) that we all sign our post with …….” |||=> Tick Tock! <-|||" that is if Lonnie has no problem.

          • Lonnie Starr says:

            No problem at all, it will jolt the outhouse crowd, 😀

          • racerrodig says:

            Tick Tock it is then

            III=> Tick – Tock <=III

    • kindheart101 says:

      Trayvon was there, and with each of us also.

      We stand UNITED!

      Justice for Trayvon.

    • racerrodig says:

      You, my friend, are The Man !! June 10th…..coming like a freight train from hell……..

      • With a one way ticket to it’s point of origin.

        • racerrodig says:

          Got a surprise especially for you
          Something that all of us have wanted to do

          Waited so long waited so long
          Waited so long waited so long

          You’ll be takin’ a long trip so far away from here
          I’ve got one ticket in my pocket now so you’ll disappear

          Waited so long waited so long
          Waited so long waited so long

          I’ve got….one ticket to prison dude
          pack you things, you leave tonight
          I’ve got……one ticket to prison dude
          I’ve got….. one ticket to prison dude

          Waited so long waited so long
          Waited so long waited so long


          You’ll be takin’ a long trip so far away from here
          I’ve got one ticket in my pocket now so you’ll disappear

          Waited so long waited so long
          Waited so long waited so long

          I’ve got….one ticket to prison dude
          pack you things, you leave tonight
          I’ve got……one ticket to prison dude
          I’ve got….. one ticket to prison dude

      • cielo62 says:

        MMP~ GOOD that you’ve found your rainbow! As for me…

  35. TommysMom says:

    Okay great hearing now I have a question. Because he’s claiming self defense,doesn’t he have to take the stand? If the jury doesn’t believe him is there still a reason for an appeal?

  36. PYorck says:

    If GZ is assigned an attorney, how much input does he have on defense strategy?

    It seems to me that an attorney who is being paid and doesn’t have to troll for donations might look at the record of the defense and decide that all the mud-slinging and arm-flailing isn’t really worth it.

    On the other hand I don’t think GZ wants a quiet defense. He wants maximum drama. He wants his everyone to know how this Decent American hero was almost killed by an almost 7-foot-tall and very black thug and how he is now the victim of a vast conspiracy.

  37. fauxmccoy says:

    follow the yellow brick road!

    • racerrodig says:

      I saw that one some years ago and it never stops being funny. I’d say Mr. Fancy Pants with his hand stands and showmanship represents just about what Fogen and the entire Zidiot Nation will endure. Then again, it’s been about 8 months of a slow Judicial Process grinding him up. Then the knockout blow.

      Either way …..”…and he’s down, Fogen is down….ladies and gentleman…..he’s down…..Fogen is down…..1 – 2 – 3 – 4 – 5 – 6, he’s not moving 7 – 8 – 9 – 10, it’s all over…..Justice has been served….”

    • No brain…..no heart……no courage……yup ol fogen needs to see the wizard 🙂

      • fauxmccoy says:

        pat – i do soooooo enjoy your contributions 🙂 thank you!

      • Lonnie Starr says:

        No point in the Wizard seeing him now, he’s so toxic a new brain or heart would be wasted. He already has the courage, unfortunately he uses it to do cowardly things, so it’d be a waste and dangerous to give him any more. Finally, the Judge won’t let him roam free, so, the only brick road he’ll be able to follow, leads to prison and not the Emerald City.

  38. Xena says:

    Defendant, GZ, vs. Judge Nelson. (GZ is the one with the long hair showing off.)

  39. Malisha says:

    What I want to see:

    What LLMPapa does with this one!

    What Trent does with this one!

    What Marinade Dave does with this one!

  40. Malisha says:

    I finally went ahead and read the first comment to the OS report on Nelson denying the delay. I can’t decide, however, whether the commenter is an a55-pole, a schmunk, a zidiot, or a boron. The defense, from his point of view, is simple: Just prove that Trayvon Martin would have been dead by now anyway (and you prove it by saying it) or that he would have been in prison by now anyway (and you prove it by saying it) and the crime becomes an uncrime.

    Well that works. Yeah, that’s the ticket. Why doesn’t he tell O’Mara that one? Oh, and that means for sure that any of us can go into any nursing home and fatally shoot anyone over 70. Doesn’t it? (Hmmm, I know a few lawyers who qualify…)

    • ladystclaire says:

      IMO the Orlando Sentinel is nothing more than a *rag* of a newspaper by the way they allow some of the comments to be posted on their site. it seems to me that a lot of these sites say they have moderators and, that certain comments will not be posted. well. I guess your comment will pass the muster only if it contains the N word as well as a lot of racist remarks about African Americans. they prohibit profanity on that site but, the *N* word is A-OK on the Orlando Sentinel.

      Imagine that if you please. I like the next person do in fact believe in freedom of speech as well as freedom of the press, but some things should not be allowed to be posted on blog sites. this country will always be a racist society as long as there are sites such as The Orlando Sentinel, You Tube and HP.

      It’s very shameful that we have some in this country who will support someone who has murdered a child and, it’s even more shameful that those same people see fit to vilify this same child all because of the color of his skin.

      • tony reay says:

        FREEDOM of speech means the FREEDOM to express even the most disgusting of opinions.
        FREEDOM of the press means the FREEDOM to print such cross sections of opinions without anything more than the legally required editing.

        so, if “like the next person” you do in fact “believe in freedom of speech as well as freedom of the press”, then you simply cannot also believe that…
        “some things should not be allowed to be posted on blog sites.”
        but, just out of curiosity, who, do you suppose, would decide WHICH things should not be allowed on blogsites??

        • I control the content that is posted here because I own this site.

          This is my virtual house, and just as you set the rules for your house, I set the rules for mine.

          My house is not a sewer. I insist on honesty, civility, respect for others and evidence-based discussion.

          Sock puppets, trolls and hatred are not welcome here.

          Anyone who disagrees is free to go elsewhere.

          The First Amendment prohibits Congress from passing laws that abridge freedom of speech and the press. It is not absolute and I am not the Congress.

        • cielo62 says:

          Freedom of Speech has NEVER covered dangerous speech, as in speech that would result in harm or death. You cannot yell Fire in a crowded movie house, just because you want to. And you cannot publish such speech as will cause violence in the ones who heed it. There IS such a thing as “hate speech” and that IS illegal and SHOULD be enforced online.

      • aussie says:

        Sorry, tony reay

        Freedom of Speech refers to what the GOVERNMENT can’t stop you saying.
        It does not apply against corporations — they have every right to make rules for the use of their site. And it is the owners who are entitled to decide where to draw the line.

  41. I have changed my mind that fogen will run…….

    I now believe he will waddle.

    Don’t know what he spent all the money on….One thing for sure…it wasn’t a Bowflex.

  42. leander22 says:

    Blackwell’s Affidavit concerning Crump’s deposition, which seemingly he only received yesterday.

    Not that it is very important. Is this usual, do I have to respond on a day’s notice in the US to such matters?

    • Malisha says:

      The affidavit was, itself, a response.

      • leander22 says:

        Malisha, I loved Crump’s response. Quite interesting too.

        Not that this will quiet them down in any way. They will spin the most exquisite conspiracy tale, I am sure. Lots of comments that a white represents a black over at the nuthousers. Does this honestly deserve mention?

        They are insulting Nelson, are speculating about getting rid of her, and seemingly about witness ( #8), if I am correct, and about a chance to file a motion for discovery violation combined with a Richardson hearing, which may have been connected to getting rid of Nelson, I forget. But the link to the affidavit was thankfully accepted as you see.

        While it starts to get obvious to everybody with eyes to see that is fishing in the lowest regions, e.g. for credit card details at 711. Even if Trayvon had bought a blunt, it has nothing at all to do with the later shot. That he would hide a blunt somewhere than come back to attack Zimmerman for it is absurd. Never they still firmly believe in their evidence to acquit only.

        Oh they have one little detail that was interesting. The man in California is an absolute specialist in cell phone Forensics:

        Det. Kuhl is also a member of the HTCAC (High Technology Crime Advisory Committee) and specializes in cell phone forensics; from October 2011:

        D. Cell Phone Forensics/Investigations

        Detective Perry Kuhl from the Santa Barbara Sheriff’s Department gave a presentation about the new cell phone forensics course at the DOJ Advanced Training Center. The course is designed to train law enforcement officials on how to find information on seized cell phones and extract it for use in the prosecution of suspects.

        I checked parts of BDLR’s response, he states that there were times that defense canceled depositions that had been arranged one or two days before they would take place. I looked that up since I wondered, when did they cancel the last hearing with Nelson? Considering a judge quite possibly has a rather busy schedule, I don’t think that was a very good idea to do that in the last few day, but they may well have done so. It also shows that the regular meetings/hearings they demanded so urgently were not even needed.

        Good day. 😉 Bad day for them, that was something I wanted to take a look at.

  43. thejbmission says:

    Happy Birthday Trayvon!!
    Judge Nelson rocks! No continuance!
    Professor, you have MOM’s number! He wants out and I don’t blame him. I’m sure Know-It-All Fogenhats thinks he knows it all. Can you imagine having a client like him? One with a dad who inserts himself into the case? And a big-mouthed brother spewing garbage on the internet which only promotes more hatred towards your client. A lying client who probably lies to his own attorney?
    MOM went into this case as a respected Florida attorney and I think he wants to salvage what’s left of that respect.
    I’m sure MOM suggested that Fogen stay in jail due to the cost of housing him and his wife. $7,000 isn’t chump change.
    IMO, $300,000 would have afforded Fogen with a more than adequate defense. Too bad, too sad for Fogen. He’s getting exactly what he deserves.

    • truthseeker66 says:

      So I take it that judge Nelson will not b issuing gag order…

      • Rachael says:

        I’d like to think she wouldn’t need to because they got the message, but considering she had to repeat herself on everything over and over, I don’t know that these guys are playing with a full deck.

    • Malisha says:

      I kind of think O’Mara will stay to the bitter end. He’ll try to “set the case up for appeal,” knowing it’s a loser, and that was the purpose of this month’s hearing. I don’t think that appeal will fly because if it did, every single criminal with private counsel could get continuances without any reason whatsoever, and Florida’s not about to start that just for Fogen.

      • Jun says:

        I also dont get how he’d appeal the continuance denial either

        because anyone can fire back that they had over a year, and they had over $300,000 minus $100,000 for bail, thats it…

        Fogenhats’ bail being revoked, the motion to bail him out, should not take more than 2 days to write, perhaps 3 days

        so 365 – 3 days of the year, thats 362 days to prepare everything

        They need a multitasker

      • Malisha says:

        Jun, before they get a multitasker, they ought to get a tasker.

        A task-oriented person who will act like a lawyer and not like a circus barker telling the public what has been “undeniable” in his client’s fiction.

    • Rachael says:

      God’s plan 😉

  44. Romaine says:

    I’m curious, if the state will be using expert witnesses, wouldn’t the defense be allowed to cross examine these same witnesses to prove their case. To me that should relieve some of the concern of cost for hiring expert witnesses of their own. Professor can you help me understand the expert witness part of the process…thank you

    • When an issue is contested and expert testimony would help the jury to resolve the disputed issue, Rule 702 provides that a person qualified by education, training or expertise in the disputed matter may testify as an expert and express an opinion about the issue.

      Each side is entitled to its own expert.

      Prohibiting an indigent defendant from using an expert paid at public expense would violate the Sixth Amendment and the Due Process Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment.

      • roderick2012 says:

        I have read that Judge Nelson could issue a continuence before the trial.

        Professsor, under what circumstances could O’Mara get a postponement later?

    • Xena says:

      It takes knowledge of the subject to effectively cross-examine an expert witness. I have seen trials where attorneys call their expert witness and then ask questions regarding what the other side’s expert testified.

      • Malisha says:

        Does anyone here think O’Mara could find an expert physiologist who would testify that it was possible for Fogen’s “grabbed my gun and shot once” story was physically possible? HA HA HA HA HA HA HA!!

      • Jun says:

        Omara does not need experts, he needs a plain liar

        There’s no forensic expert that will lie on the stand during a murder trial because that is perjury and they can go to prison and lose future work…

  45. You all have thoughtful comments says:

    Sabrina and Tracy, please know we support you with our caring thoughts on this day…… Trayvon’s birthday.

    Lean on me when times are bad
    When the day comes and you’re down
    In a river of trouble and about to drown

    Just hold on, I’m comin’
    Hold on, I’m comin’

  46. Mike says:

    what thew me off and made me laugh is that o’mara said he could call his wife as an expert that could testify, to him wanting to get this show on the road. i bet she can see its not looking good for her hubby IMO.

  47. Ty Flair says:

    All that money Fogen got from people is blood money. My grandmother use to tell me,nothing good ever come from blood money. That blood money have been nothing but trouble for them. That blood money put him back in jail for lying about the blood money. That blood money got his wife in trouble. That blood money got him fat,an who knows what kind of health problem he got now from being so big,he might have high blood preasure,high sugar an many more. Look what that blood money has done to his lawyers,they are lost now. So once again I say nothing good ever come from blood money.

  48. Rachael says:

    Professor, if O’Mara and West are going to claim GZ indigent, shouldn’t they do it pretty soon so that he can get a decent defense? Or would that be a reason for a continuence, allowing the defense to get up to par? How does this work?

    • Xena says:

      GZ doesn’t want to be declared indigent. There’s a high possibility that the court will order the trust fund dissolved to prevent GZ from receiving a significant amount of money where he is no longer indigent. That trust fund pays for the hotel room, food, laundry, etc. So, it’s not just a matter of the having no money costs of proceeding in the case but includes having no money for living expenses.

      It’s all God’s plan.

      • roderick2012 says:

        Xena says:So, it’s not just a matter of the having no money costs of proceeding in the case but includes having no money for living expenses.

        That means that the only place that George would be able to afford is jail.

        Awwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww. Maybe the Treenuts will send him enough money to keep him supplied with cherry pop tarts and calling cards.

        • Xena says:

          @roderick2012. Yep-yep-yep. GZ got himself into a real jam with those donations and O’Mara did the wrong thing when it took the fund over. He’s a defense attorney — not GZ’s guardian.

      • You all have thoughtful comments says:

        What do I think is God’s plan?……man/woman must be forced into a state of reflection to take responsibility for his/her actions.

        Yoda: Yes, run! Yes, a Jedi’s strength flows from the Force. But beware of the dark side. Anger, fear, aggression; the dark side of the Force are they. Easily they flow, quick to join you in a fight. If once you start down the dark path, forever will it dominate your destiny, consume you it will, as it did Obi-Wan’s apprentice.
        Luke: Vader… Is the dark side stronger?
        Yoda: No, no, no. Quicker, easier, more seductive.

        Luke: But how am I to know the good side from the bad?

        Yoda: You will know… when you are calm, at peace, passive.

      • You all have thoughtful comments says:

      • Malisha says:

        Also, to declare indigency would expose ALL FINANCIAL DEALINGS to scrutiny, something Fogen cannot afford to do right now and ALL family members and close friends are scared to lie for him, considering what happened to Shellie.

        And by the way: WHERE. IS. SHELLIE?

  49. Judy75201 says:

    I thought that O’Mara also might be trying to put off having to expend any money for depos and experts for as long as possible. Additionally, he has not found what he wants that will exonerate Fogen, and he wants to keep fishing for that.

    • racerrodig says:

      There isn’t a fuel tank big enough to keep that fishing trip going.

      • Maybe they’ll try a sailboat…driven by hot air?

      • excuse me, @Pat do you have deer just hanging around your truck like that?? on the picture?

        b/c i LOVE deer!!! they’re ssooo unbelievably cute!!!

        • They’re around here every day….hell they aren’t even afraid of the dog….I have another pic of them outside with our dog Mouse walking right by them……They know they’re safe here.

          • oMG i wanna cry for joy!! i just love them! and the one with his noggin in your business, he has big flppy ears!!!LOLOL

            have you seen the key deer?

          • I’ve seen Key Deer only in pictures…….don’t be fooled though….they get very aggressive with each other over food and such….they also have a pecking order so to speak…..one we named Scarface because she has a big scar over her right eye from being kicked in the head by another Deer….she’s low on the pecking order, and generally comes around by herself…and her Fawn…….they get special treatment.

  50. whonoze says:

    In lawyer-speak, Mr. Crump’s affadavit confirms what I’ve said all along: that Matt Gutman has an intelligible recording of the Crump/W8 interview.

    “24. While I believe Mr. Gutman and his assistant may also have had a recording device of their own present with them in the room during some or all of the Interview, I have no knowledge as to whether that device was ever successfully used to record any portion of the Interview [5]”

    footnote 5:
    “I did not provide a copy of the Recording to Mr. Gutman, his assistant or anyone else affiliated with ABC, not did I otherwise make the Recorder available to them so they could make a copy.”

    Well if Atty. Crump didn’t give a copy to Gutman, Gutman’s device must have been recording successfully, since ABC played soundbites from the interview as part of several news stories. If Crump has no knowledge of it I guess he must watch Fox news instead of ABC… 🙂

    Oh, right, he’s an NBC guy… 😀

    • KA says:

      I read it. I think it really covers anything that the Defense could ask him. I find it amusing that Crump addresses the “Big Conspiracy Theory” so well as it goes with his contact with W8. He has not talked to her since. He had witnesses to the talk he had with her. No attorney (or anyone else of intelligence) would assume a REPORTER is going to be quiet about his conversation and tactics. He had witnesses for a reason. He complied completely with deposition rules (although he wan’t required to).

      I guess all the Z – supporters can say now is “Crump is lying”…but that is not going to go anywhere, especially with the defense, lest the timing of knowledge of Z funds is brought up with O’Mara….

      They have nothing on Crump. I suspect there is little place for the defense to go on additional questioning as well.

      • Malisha says:

        They are just incensed with Crump because he has succeeded in everything he has tried to accomplish so far, and because he has immense power, dignity and professionalism. They’re just not used to any of that.

    • Jun says:

      It comes off very thorough

      unlike Team Fogenhats and their nonsensical lying

      I still dont get why Junior still tries to deny that his brother stalked Trayvon, like he has various other people in that complex, with a gun…

      There’s no science out there that will say that having your head bashed into concrete causes only two tiny superficial cuts that had already healed when EMT arrived, which was about 5 minutes or so after the shot, and the defendant showed no signs of having his head bashed (he was not dazed and only had really minor bleeding and even refused EMT service)

      Fogenhats sustained his tiny wuss cuts while standing up, and his head tilted forward at about a 45 degree angle, hence the bleeding straight down in a line across his cheek and goatee because of gravity

      There’s also no forensic trace that the victim even attacked the defendant in self defense, although the victim had every right because he was in reasonable fear of great bodily harm and death, due to the fact that Fogenhats stalked, chased, pursued, terrorized, attacked, threatened and killed a kid with a gun

      I dont even know why people listen to those idiots… it is so clear what happened, and he’s lying repeatedly

      • racerrodig says:

        “I dont even know why people listen to those idiots…”

        Racist Gun NutZZ

      • rayvenwolf says:

        Early on I used to think his supporters simply had never been thee victims of a violent beat down, known anyone who had or seen a news report on someone who had and seen the end result. After seeing them simply IGNORE pictures of victims of such crime and what they looked like days later it became very clear that it really wasn’t about supporting GZ and only supporting what he’d done – killed a “thug” in the making.

    • looneydoone says:

      Two thoughts (and I seldom comment on anyone’s physical appearance)
      re: gz
      Ha engordo tanto que parece zepelin
      cuando el entierren la tierra el va a vomitar

      • blushedbrown says:



        Seldom do I also comment on apperances, but please have barf bag with you at all times. 🙂

        I am still cracking up at the placas clackas. Eveytime I see O’mara I think of your comment, and crack up.

  51. kindheart101 says:

    Judge Nelson took, her honored place,
    she listened well, this is HER case.
    Until the Jury, takes the stand,
    It’s up to her, she’s in command.

    All eyes were fixed, the time was here,
    she looked at them, she showed no fear.
    She asked them, why they need more time?
    I set a date, you’re out of line!

    DENIED she barked, the day is set,
    you had your time, no more you’ll get!
    A June date, is what you will keep,
    no favors from this court, you’ll reap.

    This court is fair, “I STAND MY GROUND”,
    please listen, I have been around.
    I’ve seen it all, I know the game,
    of money, lies, and seeking fame.

    So now it’s clear, for all to know,
    “MY COURT”, will never be a show.
    Both sides have heard me, straight, and true,
    it’s time to do, what you must do.

    This isn’t just a Petty Crime,
    it’s Murder 2, don’t waste my time!
    We’ll meet again, in March, and so,
    you are DISMISSED, and you may go.

    Happy Birthday Trayvon. Justice is getting closer day by day.

    Sybrina and Tracy…….Love and (((Hugs))) to you.

  52. amsterdam1234 says:

    Do you care to speculate about why the GPS data wasn’t mentioned? And do you think we will get to see that evidence before the trial?

  53. roderick2012 says:

    The Treenuts have lost it.

    They are resorting to demeaning Judge Nelson’s appearance and asking her to be removed for not granting a continuence to Chubby and ‘pandering’ to Crump.

    Those tools are so full of hate.

    • roderick2012….That’s what I figured they would say. I always go over there to see what they have to say before and after these events and have observed their very predictable reaction every time. They, like fogen, blame everyone else but the one who is truly guilty.

    • Rachael says:

      It is hilarious to go over there today. OMG, they’ve come totally unglued.

      • SoulSistaWoo says:

        I very very rarely go into that cesspool of hate…But, I just could not resist today… They have huge picture of Judge Nelson dressed as a Nazi and their all rallying around it, posting encouraging comments to sooth one another’s bruised egos

        • Xena says:


          They have huge picture of Judge Nelson dressed as a Nazi …

          So now they paint GZ as Jewish? LOL!!! Anything to make him look like the victim.

      • are you serious? dressed as a nazi>??
        lololol dumb asses, they just can’t accept you can’t kill someone and just say any ol bullshit and forget about it?????!!!

      • Malisha says:

        I vociferously object to Fogen being characterized as a Jew; we have enough problems with Jews who really ARE Jews to be importing some like Fogen who are NOT!

    • Xena says:


      The Treenuts have lost it.

      Uhh– you have to have something before you can lose it. 🙂

    • Malisha says:

      Whoever does not agree with them or give them what they want is a dirty low-down mean stupid criminal — oh wait a minute, isn’t that what Fogen believes? He MENTORED THEM!! 😈

      • Kelly Payne says:

        if they’ve lost it,it means more insults against trayvon and his family

        • Xena says:

          @Kelly Payne

          if they’ve lost it,it means more insults against trayvon and his family

          After putting on full anti-disease armor, I read some comments posted to the Yahoo article. There are some insulting towards Trayvon and some racially derogatory comments as well. However, the most from the Zidiots are conspiracy theories of GZ being setup by the government who setup things with the court, yada, yada, yada. One I found funny said that GZ needs a judge that can’t be paid off by attorney Crump.

          In other words, it is everyone’s fault of than GZ’s.

    • rayvenwolf says:

      Having looked around at a few articles, the Z nation is starting to show their hand(lack of faith in GZ) more today. Between calling for Nelson to be replaced, the case to be dropped again etc etc the death rattle is getting louder with each comment.

    • Jun says:

      Is the Conservative Tinfoil Hat not Nazis themselves?

      They are the ones who feel a teenage boy walking home with skittles and ice tea deserve stalking, harassment, attack, and killing

      That sounds very Nazi-ish

  54. So….MOM got what he could out of this mess…office equiptment….and then kicked ol’ fogen to the curb…

    • I also have to wonder what MOM told fogen (to prepare him for today’s hearing) either in the days or moments before the hearing. Did he lie to fogen and say that everything will be ok, all the while knowing that he wanted to jump this sinking ship?

      • Rachael says:

        I don’t know, but he sure didn’t say anything to him after the hearing. I don’t know if he just has a very poor “bedside manner,” or if he just doesn’t want to talk with GZ at all. Of course, they might know the cameras are still on so he doesn’t want someone reading lips and figuring out what they are talking about, but I rather doubt that. They just turned their backs and left him there. No had on the shoulder for encouragement, no nothing.

    • SoulSistaWoo says:

      Well… West did pat him on the back… Sorta like “It wasn’t our day today buddy, better luck next time” or ” Sorry dude, it’s was nice to have met you.”

      It was real pathetic…

      Did Fogen look shell shocked to any of you… At one point I could almost read his mind… like he was trying to appear as though what had just happen, was par for the course and he understood that, and at other times he looked as though he was trying to figure out who he could throw under the bus and get out of this… Fogen looked abandoned and worried today.

      • Xena says:

        GZ was sitting there thinking, “Since the court won’t give me a continuance, I’ll just use up the money that’s already in the fund. Why budget for expert witnesses. I’m hungry.”

      • cielo62 says:

        SoulSistaWoo~ He was indeed abandoned today. No fawning lawyers, no devoted Shellie, not even ol’ buddy Osterman.

        • Lonnie Starr says:

          By now they’ve all heard the conflicting stories GZ has told and now realize there’s no way out. Worse yet, GZ has left open a series of conspiracy theories that could conceivably rope any of them in as well. So they decided to scatter like roaches when the kitchen light comes on, rather than get caught by the spray of raid.
          Justice for Trayvon is coming |||=> Tick Tock! <-|||

          • racerrodig says:

            I’ll say it again….something really devastating is afoot. The phone records, the GPS, his posse’s phone records, more CCTV – something. One of my guys stopped in late this afternoon to chat and he’s laughing at this in a way I’ve never seen before.

            I’ll go back to the sequence of calls the hour before the murder and the few minutes after……I’ll make a bet that’s what has caused this obvious upheaval………I asked where was his posse……a giggle
            where was SheLie……..a snicker….

            Any takers one of them turned States Evidence ??

          • I’ve been saying all along that it’s in Shellie’s best interests to cut and run. That’s her only way out of this mess. I won’t be surprised if it happens. I’ll be surprised that it took so long.

          • racerrodig says:

            Funny you mention that. One of my “guys” stopped in yesterday to talk about my doing some more work on his car and we got to bs’ing (I gave him the 3rd degree actually) about this case like we always do.

            There is no doubt that the phone records are one of the crushers. By the giggle reaction I’d say SheLie will or has already turned States Evidence. I believe 4 other phone records will come into play spanning a time frame of about 1/2 hour to few minutes after the gunshot. I also believe one other witness, I believe #6, has made addition statements that will sink him even further.

            I’ll also say I think O’ Mara is drafting a “Get out of Dodge” Motion as we speak.

            I am convinced the Feds are going to get Hate Crime action up and running depending on how the next few months unravel. I know for a fact they don’t want any “…everyone’s picking on FogenPhoole” sympathy to arise.

            Professor, from your last round of New Blogs i’d say you may have their phones tapped !!!!!!!!

          • jm says:

            racerrodig: “I’ll go back to the sequence of calls the hour before the murder and the few minutes after……I’ll make a bet that’s what has caused this obvious upheaval………I asked where was his posse……a giggle where was SheLie……..a snicker….

            Maybe that is a big part of why GZ has those dark circles under his crazy eyes and MOM looks downright grim.

            |||=> Tick Tock! <-|||

          • racerrodig says:

            I’d bet the farm at this point he knows the end is near, you have that correctamundo.

            |||=> Tick Tock! <-|||

    • racerrodig says:

      That must be one hell of a printer.

  55. cielo62 says:

    Running to catch up! I missed over 300 comments on the live trhead! DANG!!

    • i know how you feel! hate when that happens!!!
      just the other day i had to just stop myself and say self, your not gonna die if you miss one damn day!!LOLO i 3 posts behind but only one day!!LOL

  56. Maybe he can now get Judge Eaton to come in and represent him. He wanted him involved in this case so bad. I was surprised she didn’t grant some continuance even though I do agree she was in her right not to do so. All in all it was a good day for Justice for Trayvon on what would have been his 18th birthday.

    • KA says:

      No, I think Alan Dershowitz should have to represent him as punishment for his antics and harassment of Corey over the initial affidavit.

      He obviously thinks he can win this and this case was preposterous and irresponsible (you know, easy peasy).

      • Malisha says:

        Jeralyn go get pro hac’ed into FL and represent him, PUL-LEEZ! :mrgreen:

      • Looolooo says:


      • KA says:

        Funny, Alan has not made comment on this case since June. Interesting for a man so public about the “ridiculousness” of the charge in the first place. He made interviews nonstop from April to June…now silence.

        I wonder if Harvard had something to do with that or he found out something that refuted his extreme position…

      • Haha…but ultimately who were REALLY be punished if he serves as defense counsel…him or US LOL

      • abbyj says:

        @KA re: Dersh. Amen. The way he shot off his mouth about Corey was embarrassingly unprofessional. Surprising that more people didn’t condemn him for it. Yes, if he thinks he’s the Grand Poobah of American jurisprudence, let him come in, pro bono, and win this case for fogen.

  57. rayvenwolf says:

    Watching the hearing this immediately came to mind

    • Malisha says:

      This one came to my mind:

      • rayvenwolf says:

        The jig as they say is up. If West and OMoney bow out I can hear the bitching from the Treeslum already. Then again most of them are soooo sure right now that The scheme team have things well in hand. I guess they can’t read body language.

  58. Xena says:

    And here I was thinking that they were smiling out of embarrassment. (Haha)

    It’s all God’s plan.

    • Eric says:

      HA! They were. It’s funny now that money is gone how almost intolerant of Fogen they have become.

      • lurker says:

        Well, O’Mara got some new office equipment and on-air time out of it. Some interns got the experience of slogging through real evidence files (for free, except for the occasional pizza). So, balance that against the loss to the security firm and maybe it’s a wash.

        What happens to the NBC lawsuit then?

    • Two sides to a story says:

      Yup, but please God, extend the plan. Don’t let the trial be delayed after indigency . . . : – /

      • Xena says:

        @Two sides. Actually, I don’t think O’Mara is going to file for GZ’s indigence because GZ doesn’t want him to. O’Mara has been talking that talk since the Hannity interview. If GZ admits he’s indigent, then he also admits that he has no supporters or in the least, supporters who care about him as a person. That’s a hard pill for GZ to swallow.

      • Two sides to a story says:

        They might have other BS up their sleeves, but it’s hard to say what. They look to me like they’re gladly done with him. Perhaps they’re just happy to have an excuse about the self-defense hearing. Perhaps they’ll get some cheapo experts lined up. Perhaps they’ll just follow through to the end and then try to appeal. They can still have lots of fun trying to claim the state railroaded Fogen. Heck, they might even keep coming up with 5k a month, for whatever that’s worth.

      • so it will squash gz’s petite ego like a tick if he declared a pauper!!LOLOLO

        Xena it is pathetic that he has to get gov funds now! ya know, we’re already paying a boat load for the prosecution and then the enormous cost of housing him in prison for the rest of forever! oh and all the ho ho’s and ding dongs and peanut butter sandwiches!! omggg

        and,,,,look Donna Flores found and posted something yesterday,about those jail calls in spanish!!
        so while he’s laid up in jail he’s REALLY super delusional talking all big and bad, he’s suggesting as if, i quess him or his wealthy family will just put up the house for his million dollar bail!!
        lemme see, how quick you think ol zimminini-papa and aunt gladys forget this bad seed even exists and accidentally lose those fancy new cell phones.

        see what a complete dumbass?? i don’t see why he doesn’t just BEG for it all to be over and go ahead and move into prison.. it’s cheaper on him, he won’t have to worry about toilet paper and he won’t be so publically humiliated and laughing stock!
        @ Milisha, you were looking for this info about that meeting at the HOA Chief Billy Badass Lee!!LOLOL


        This jail call is in Spanish. Is there anything of interest in the call?



        Donna Flores says:

        February 4, 2013 at 12:19 pm

        What an ass, nothing really but he has a big swollen head. He asked a guard to use the phone in spanish and she says, I didn’t know you know Spanish. He said I speak it perfect. Google me if you want autograph. I despise this man. Mostly just talking

        about coming up with the money for the bond. Selling a house, putting the house on collateral.


        You all have thoughtful comments says:

        February 4, 2013 at 9:45 am

        Yes, Rachael……and from that same link:

        Some of Zimmerman’s neighbors said he had a history of being overly aggressive and followed people whom he thought appeared suspicious back to their homes.

        At an emergency homeowner’s association meeting on March 1, days after the killing, “one man was escorted out because he openly expressed his frustration because he had previously contacted the Sanford Police Department about Zimmerman approaching him and even coming to his home,” a resident who spoke on the condition of anonymity told HuffPost. “It was also made known that there had been several complaints about George Zimmerman and his tactics” in his neighborhood watch role.

        Rachael says:

      • roderick2012 says:

        Xena says:If GZ admits he’s indigent, then he also admits that he has no supporters or in the least, supporters who care about him as a person. That’s a hard pill for GZ to swallow.

        That would mean that the ‘masses’ have abandoned George…

        BWA WA WA WA!!!

        • Xena says:


          That would mean that the ‘masses’ have abandoned George…

          Kinda makes me wonder what would have happened had GZ not spent donations on his pre-Feb. 26, 2012 debts, and not lied to the court about how much he had received in donations?

          I mean, here was a man who had been arrested, and the majority of the $200,000 was donated while he was in jail. He needs bail money, right? However, while he’s in jail, he’s instructing his wife and sister on moving money between accounts, withdrawing money and putting it in a safe deposit box, and then to pay off (not pay on or catch up to make current) debts.

          Then his wife tells him that she has his valid passport, so GZ knows that the passport he gave to his attorney is not valid. To top it off, they talk about what a wonderful life they are going to have when he gets out.

          To get a low bail, his wife misrepresents her knowledge of the money to the court while GZ sits there like a potted palm.

          Can he sincerely believe that his number of supporters would increase after he demonstrated such dishonesty? Include with this that last night, his brother on Piers Morgan, stirred the racial pot, argued with Piers in a double-standard manner, and showed disrespect for the victims of Sandy Hook.

    • Malisha says:

      Right, Xena. They were beat up in court and had to look like they weren’t or their fan base would be humiliated and they are not allowed to humiliate their fan base. Fogen, notice, does not have to keep looking happy-go-lucky because they’re now going to adopt the line that he is being persecuted, so he can look martyred and in terrible anguish. Everybody play their roles.

      Although nothing ever can make up to Trayvon’s family and friends what was taken from them, still I feel that they got the beginning of “their props” today — no no, I mean that the beginning of their props was when Sharpton, Jackson et al. jumped in to help and then when the nation turned their faces towards them, but this is the beginning of a new era of them getting “their props” in the form of the court announcing in no uncertain terms that this really IS GOING TO BE DEALT WITH.

      • Xena says:

        @Malisha. From the time that Judge Lester revoked GZ’s bond and ordered him back to jail, I’ve seen every hearing thereafter as just, and not to GZ’s benefit. Motions granting discovery requests are routine. Motions for his personal benefit — DENIED. Motions to intimidate witnesses — DENIED. Motions to intimidate a non-witness – postponed.

        And West cannot bully Judge Nelson into changing her decisions.

        It’s all God’s plan.

        • As a practical matter, I think it may have been ineffective assistance of counsel for MOM and West to get Judge Lester removed from the case. That argument will never fly at the appellate level, even though they appear to be in worse shape with Judge Nelson.

          In reality their rulings might have been the same with the probable exception of the second motion for bail. I think she would have denied him bail.

          • Xena says:


            In reality their rulings might have been the same with the probable exception of the second motion for bail. I think she would have denied him bail.

            That would have saved GZ lots of money; avoided the Hannity interview that is now discovery for the prosecution, and possibly avoided the weight gain. Maybe Shellie would have proceeded to trial by now too. Funny how things happen.

          • racerrodig says:

            I was shocked, as were every one of the lawyers I do reports for that he got bail the 2nd time. It is very unlikely he would have gotten bail in NJ after lying to the court.

      • Operacarla says:

        I thought fogen looked like he was seething. He thinks he is the smartest guy in the room and is mad that he can’t control the entire courtroom his way. mom and west put a sock in his mouth and he really, really doesn’t like it. I think he will explode at trial.

  59. KA says:

    I thought of something.

    I think O’Mara knew he would not get a continuance as he could not even articulate a reason to actually have one. What it did do for them though was give a great excuse to supporters on why there will be no immunity hearing. He now [unfairly positioned] has no time to adequately prepare.

    He gets to keep GZ off the stand in an embarrassing public forum and he still has supporters that “believe” in GZ’s innocence and will continue to support them. It is all the “State’s” fault.

    I had long wondered how O’Mara would get out of an immunity hearing after being so public about the “clarity” of evidence towards GZ innocence.

    Had O’Mara decided, as a matter of strategy, that he would not have an immunity hearing, I think the supporters would turn on him.

    BTW, I am not sure if anyone remembers but West QUIT HIS JOB for this case.

    Probably a bad move.

    • LOLO no i didn’t know west quit his job for this?!! OMG he sure looks even moreeee stupidddder*!!

      but i knew they wouldn’t have a immunity hearing. there’s no way for him to win.

      • KA says:

        Yes, but how would they explain that to the supporters? They (all 50 of them) are convinced that he will be “set free” at an immunity hearing.

        They are all depending on it. I think for O’Mara to keep the supporters, he had to find a way out of that commitment to them. This provides a common enemy (Judge Nelson and the State) and gives him a “I want to do an immunity hearing, but can’t” explanation to keep them giving, all the way to trial.

        O’Mara looks like he has aged considerably in the last 9 months. I suspect had he had a crystal ball….

      • KA says:

        Yes, he was a defense attorney for Federal court if I remember right.

      • Malisha says:

        Federal public defenders are generally pretty good.

      • pat deadder says:

        His brother was on Piers Morgan last night I couln’t bear to watch but I should have,Didn’t want to up the ratings for his BS,

        • Xena says:

          I received notification that Trent Sawyer (stateoftheinternet) has the video of Junior’s interview on Piers Morgan. When I get time, I’ll watch it.

    • roderick2012 says:

      “Had O’Mara decided, as a matter of strategy, that he would not have an immunity hearing, I think the supporters would turn on him. ”

      I always thought that the threatening phone call that O’Mara received last year was from a GZ supporter not anyone aligned with Trayvon.

    • lurker says:

      I acknowledge the real difficulty in holding an immunity hearing. However, without the illusion of self-defense, what legs does he have to stand on. As far as the killing is concerned, George has already admitted that he did it. That has never been in question>

      • Malisha says:

        SYG HEARING: Shouldn’t take that long to prepare for.

        Fogen can get on the stand and swear his oath. Then he can say, “I was going to Target after we mentored the kids. And I saw a suspicious guy. He was walking leisurely in the rain. I knew that was wrong, and my wife was scared. I’m a decent American and I love African Americans and they love me. Dearly. I do have one token white friend and he wrote a book. I’m very important because God chose me to work out his plan. Anyway I was looking for an address and sure enough this suspicious guy sucker-punched me and I fell to the ground and he mounted me and nearly killed me. I yelled “Help Me!” 16 or more times. I felt like my head was gonna explode. There was blood all in my eyes. My brother even said there was blood coming out of my ears. And I had to kill him. Otherwise I would be wearing diapers now and eating with a spoon. Speaking of which, do you have anything to eat around here?”

        Then cross examination happens:

        Q: Is that all you have to say?
        A: Uh…no, I should also say that I don’t regret a thing.

        BDLR: I’m through with this witness, Your Honor.

        Judge: I’m through with him too. Denied.

      • MelRoy says:

        At one point he said he would not pursue an immunity hearing. He was very clear on that. He would go for a straight self-defense claim at trial.

        Then he changed his mind – probably due to pressure from his client, who in turn was under pressure from the HOA.

        I seem to recall that the HOA were uninsured – because Trayvon’s mother tried to make a claim, and the insurers denied on the basis the HOA only took the policy out AFTER the shooting.

    • leander22 says:

      I did occasionally leave one job for another, but I have never heard of somebody leaving his job completely for an unpaid one. Are you sure? Hmm, makes me wonder.

      Besides shortly before State of the Art switches to Google on his video West seems to slap Fogen on his shoulder.

      He shortly talks to him with MOM watching from a little further off too. We can’t see if he says something he turns us his back. That’s the same segment towards the end.


      There was a deposition of someone we do not know yet, I have been wondering for quite some time now, who witness #4 and witness #7 are.

    • Mary Davis says:

      @ KA. you made me pee on myself laughing with your coments about fogens spending all the money. Your comment with “What is he, The President” made me cry laughing. You really should not do that to an old lady.

  60. blushedbrown says:

    Now that the writing is on the wall, and gz has no clue what his own attorneys have done to him. I can only imagine their plan to get the hell of of dodge was not discussed with him.

    What now? Does papa zim call in some chips, I think he may have used them up already.

    I wonder if we will hear rumors of gz trying to call Corey with a plea for a deal.

    • The prosecution has no incentive to deal the case.

      • blushedbrown says:

        Yeah, I know. But I can just see it happening, he has nothing to lose in asking.

      • Malisha says:

        Un…less…the incentive is that if there is a plea there doesn’t have to be a trial, and if there is no trial, some really incriminating (against state ACTORS, not against Fogen) evidence will inevitably come out and the civil suits against police, prosecutors etc. will roll in and millions and millions of dollars will roll out.

      • Will W8 be required to tell them her social media login information, or is she permitted to refuse?

      • rayvenwolf says:

        @Diary – I believe its only her handles she has to disclose. Technically giving them her login info is a breech of TOS for both Twitter & FB.

      • MelRoy says:

        I cannot imagine Zimmerman copping to man 1 or even man 2, he imagines his narrative is convincing.

      • Jun says:

        According to FDLE’s response in regards to the info Omara asked for, witnesses do not have to give out their personal info to homicide defendants, and it is up to them

        I feel twitter and facebook fall under that so she can legally say no I think

    • he’ll get the same treatment he got last time he tried to call, the receptionist took a message and BDLR called his lawyer and when they tried to call gz 3way he was so embarrassed he hung up on them! LOLOLOL

      i gotta find what i wrote about what that message he left, it was very funny cas he really thought he WAS SOMEBODY!!! LOLO i’ll post it when i find it!

    • towerflower says:

      diary: From what I got they will schedule a video conference for Wit. 8 in which she will have to disclose what her FB and twitter accounts are.

      The state asked that they be sealed and it was granted.

      MOM made a passing comment about “we would rather have accurate information.” Guess he has relied too much on sites like CTH and their bad information.

    • pat deadder says:

      Could it be they have told him the only way to get a continuance is to declare him indigent since court appointed lawyers will need time to go over the case,

  61. did you think Omar seem like he was just wasting time talking about nothing really? like he didn’t even prepare for the hearing by having anything to say?

    so i think you’re right, they both are going to dump him like a 300 pound malignant tumor!

    • He sounded like he didn’t have anything to say because he truly didn’t have anything to say.

      • Eric says:

        If O’Mara quits this case, won’t that be a client killer? Shouldn’t they stay to show future clients that they will fight the good fight?

        • Nope, not in this world where most lawyers demand all your money up front and take the title to your most expensive possession or deed to your house as security for the rest of the fee.

          Working for free for a difficult and wretched client who doesn’t appreciate it, is just plain stupid.

      • abbyj says:

        Hello Professor, Thank you for your observations and comments about today’s hearing. O’M did have very little to say, and neither did West, the latter of whom spoke so very briefly at the end. Neither one of these lawyers appeared interested in the proceedings. No surprise there.

        My question is: from this point out, how soon do you sense that O’M might arrange for fogen to declare himself indigent? Would that declaration be at the advice of counsel?

        I’m also wondering what will happen to the $40K of renovations and upgrades O’M made to his office to accommodate fogen’s big trial? Would he have to repay that to fogen’s slush fund?

        Thanks very much!

        btw, that new hairstyle that fogen sported today, with the hair all pile into a pointy peak on the top of his head is officially known as a “faux hawk.”

      • pat deadder says:

        Do you think they are just killing time to raise enough money to pay the AIS lawsuit,

    • Tzar says:

      I don’t think he prepared for any hearing except the first bail hearing. He always seemed to be fumbling through a box for files that he should have anticipated having on hand.

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s

%d bloggers like this: